Fisrt Cycle (confused)

[TRYINGTOGAIN]

Hi this is the first time I try posting in this forum.
I am 25 yo at 5'9 , 145-150#. I have been working out for about 3 years, and I have achieved definition, but I want some BULK. I wanna gain at least 10-15 pounds. My confusiong is that I though Deca was a very safe steroid for the first cycle, but as I read the forum, it seems that Sustanon is the steroid of choice. I am aware of the post cycling use of clomid.

My questions are
1. How much should I expect to gain if I use sustanon
2. Is 250mg/week for 8 weeks good enough
3. Would it be better if I use deca with tes.

Thanks a LOT

 

[Eze]

You are only 150 pounds and you want to do steroids? I would go to the grocery store and spend your money on Steak and Chicken and leave the steroids for later.

 

[fatchops]

You are only 150 pounds and you want to do steroids? I would go to the grocery store and spend your money on Steak and Chicken and leave the steroids for later.

Exactly bro, were not trying to flame but you can put on some mass with just eating a ton.

 

[Trevdog]

The importance of diet cannot be overemphasized, but I'm going to take a shot at responding to your questions.

How much you will gain is impossible to know beforehand. It depends on training, genetics, diet, rest, drugs, etc. Having said that, 10-15 lbs. or more is definately possible on your first cycle with test.

Personally, I will not build a cycle without test. It is so versitile and effective that to me it makes no sense to leave it out. As you probably know, sustenon is a form of testosterone, a blend of 4 different esters, some release over a short period of time, some over a longer period. A lot of people don't like it, but I think it is useful. One drawback is that it takes about 3 weeks after the last shot to leave the system, during this time you are sort of in "limbo", your blood levels of test are less than optimal, but yet too high to allow your body to recover its natural testosterone production. Definately read the tread in our educational forum which I think I posted but which was authored by Andy13, its called something like "A review of modern AS cycling theory". It discusses how to deal with this issue.

8 weeks of sustenon is fine, but keep in mind that you will not be able to start recovery with clomid until week 11. For this reason, it would be a good idea to use a fast acting test, such as test propinate, during weeks 9 - 10 1/2.

IMO 250 mgs. per week of test is not worth doing. I recommend you go with 500, and yes I realize this is your first cycle and you only weigh 150 lbs. You MUST have anti estrogens on hand, and you may wish to take them even if you don't get much bloat or gynomastia.

The cycle would probably be more effective if you also ran deca, but it probably isn't necessary. 300-400 mgs. per week is a decent dose to consider. I do not recommend deca without test. You may experience the dreaded "deca dick" - loss of libido, impotence.

 

[TRYINGTOGAIN]

Thanks for the replies. I know eating ad diet is a big part of it, but trust me I eat lots of protein, and have a balanced diet. Also, I try taking protein shakes in between meals. I guess I am a REALLY hard gainer. I have come a long way. I had to fight genetics and went from weighing 120 (not a typo) to 150, but have been stuck here for a while. I am trying changes in my workout routine and see if that helps me get over the plateau. Just need an effective way to gain some bulk.
Thanks for you help

 

[Eze]

The importance of diet cannot be overemphasized, but I'm going to take a shot at responding to your questions.

How much you will gain is impossible to know beforehand. It depends on training, genetics, diet, rest, drugs, etc. Having said that, 10-15 lbs. or more is definately possible on your first cycle with test.

Personally, I will not build a cycle without test. It is so versitile and effective that to me it makes no sense to leave it out. As you probably know, sustenon is a form of testosterone, a blend of 4 different esters, some release over a short period of time, some over a longer period. A lot of people don't like it, but I think it is useful. One drawback is that it takes about 3 weeks after the last shot to leave the system, during this time you are sort of in "limbo", your blood levels of test are less than optimal, but yet too high to allow your body to recover its natural testosterone production. Definately read the tread in our educational forum which I think I posted but which was authored by Andy13, its called something like "A review of modern AS cycling theory". It discusses how to deal with this issue.

8 weeks of sustenon is fine, but keep in mind that you will not be able to start recovery with clomid until week 11. For this reason, it would be a good idea to use a fast acting test, such as test propinate, during weeks 9 - 10 1/2.

IMO 250 mgs. per week of test is not worth doing. I recommend you go with 500, and yes I realize this is your first cycle and you only weigh 150 lbs. You MUST have anti estrogens on hand, and you may wish to take them even if you don't get much bloat or gynomastia.

The cycle would probably be more effective if you also ran deca, but it probably isn't necessary. 300-400 mgs. per week is a decent dose to consider. I do not recommend deca without test. You may experience the dreaded "deca dick" - loss of libido, impotence.

I don't agree with this Trevdog. He is 5'9" and 145-150 lbs, so I don't think that steroids are the answer.





TRYINGTOGAIN,
What does you current diet look like?

Calories? Protein? Carbs? Fat?

What is your current workout routine?
Are you getting enough rest?

If all of these are in check, there is NO WAY you should be stuck at 150lbs.

 

[djufo]

I think it is the diet...probably you think that eating tons of protein will make you gain muscle mass and weight but that's not right. You need a very well balanced diet with good fats, carbs and protein. Eat about 5 to 7 meal per day, and eat real food; not just shakes or bars. Make every gram count. The right proportion of each food will keep your body with enough fuel to develop mass and controlled weight. If that doesn't work, then you'll NEED juice.

 

[Batman]

Come on guys! Juice helps, no question about that. If he's been training for 5 years gaining 30 lbs as a "natural" he's already done a good job, don't you agree?
he does not look like someone who's just arrived and wants to gain tons with a first cycle. He looks like he knows himself.

 

[TRYINGTOGAIN]

Thanks man. I agree.. I am still training a lot, and I am not disagreeing with the guys that say that my diet is what's maybe lacking since it seems due to my stats that I am not eating enough. However, I know diet is very important, and I believe I have a well balanced diet. I just want some extra help. The reason why I am asking questions is to get a good idea of what to do and what not to do. I am not using them yet, but I am thinking of using them in the future so I want to know a good way to get started if I were to use them.
thanks again

 

['tensity]

The importance of diet cannot be overemphasized, but I'm going to take a shot at responding to your questions.

How much you will gain is impossible to know beforehand. It depends on training, genetics, diet, rest, drugs, etc. Having said that, 10-15 lbs. or more is definately possible on your first cycle with test.

Personally, I will not build a cycle without test. It is so versitile and effective that to me it makes no sense to leave it out. As you probably know, sustenon is a form of testosterone, a blend of 4 different esters, some release over a short period of time, some over a longer period. A lot of people don't like it, but I think it is useful. One drawback is that it takes about 3 weeks after the last shot to leave the system, during this time you are sort of in "limbo", your blood levels of test are less than optimal, but yet too high to allow your body to recover its natural testosterone production. Definately read the tread in our educational forum which I think I posted but which was authored by Andy13, its called something like "A review of modern AS cycling theory". It discusses how to deal with this issue.

8 weeks of sustenon is fine, but keep in mind that you will not be able to start recovery with clomid until week 11. For this reason, it would be a good idea to use a fast acting test, such as test propinate, during weeks 9 - 10 1/2.

IMO 250 mgs. per week of test is not worth doing. I recommend you go with 500, and yes I realize this is your first cycle and you only weigh 150 lbs. You MUST have anti estrogens on hand, and you may wish to take them even if you don't get much bloat or gynomastia.

The cycle would probably be more effective if you also ran deca, but it probably isn't necessary. 300-400 mgs. per week is a decent dose to consider. I do not recommend deca without test. You may experience the dreaded "deca dick" - loss of libido, impotence.

I agree with the upping of the test to at least 500mg/week and I would agree with the waiting part as well and upping the diet given the stats, but at 25, his biggest natural test level production is starting to wane (but by no means ineffective). If you've been training seriously for several years, I don't think starting your 1st cycle now is a major mistake. Bt, would also suggest trying to tweak the diet and see what results that brings first. Check out some of the articles for bulk diets and formulas.

 

[fatchops]

I agree with the upping of the test to at least 500mg/week and I would agree with the waiting part as well and upping the diet given the stats, but at 25, his biggest natural test level production is starting to wane (but by no means ineffective). If you've been training seriously for several years, I don't think starting your 1st cycle now is a major mistake. Bt, would also suggest trying to tweak the diet and see what results that brings first. Check out some of the articles for bulk diets and formulas.

check out my bulking diet lol, yeah baby!!!

 

[TRYINGTOGAIN]

check out my bulking diet lol, yeah baby!!!

Thanks again for the replies. Where could I find your diet fatchops?

 

[theRock]

What do you consider eating a lot and clean? I would venture that if you are not eating 3000-4000 calories day, EVERDAY, consistently, then you really are not eating what you think you are. Have you ever counted your calories? When i lifted naturally, I thought i hit a plateau at 180, but hit 195, when i made sure i did the 3000 cal + thing for a good 3 months. Who knows - you may be eating 5-6 meals a day, but if each are pretty small at only 400 cal each, then you aren't even hitting 3000! And for a hardgainer at only 150, I would think that is a must. Check your diet bro.

Just my 02.

 

[TRYINGTOGAIN]

I eat pretty well. I make sure to have a breakfast with about 600-800 calories. If I don't have time to have a decent breakfast, I take a weight gain shake, that on itself has ( claims to have ) 700 calories and about 30g protein. Lunch is usually a burger meal (with fries) or something of that kind (I try to make sure I eat meat at lunch always). snack in the afternoon a sandwich, protein bar or whatever I can get my hands on. Dinner usually fish chicken or steak with potatoes or something similar. and I always have another snack before bed. It obviously varies from day to day, but I eat a lot for a small guy.
What most people don't understand is that I am genetically predisposed to be slender. my mom weighs about 104 pounds and my dad used to weigh less than me (til he got old). I am fighting genetics and getting to 150 is an accomplishment on its own. Like I said, I haven't done roids, but I am trying to get the knowledge for whenever I try using them. Gaining 30 pounds in a few years is a lot for me. I just want some more in the near future.

 

[Trevdog]

I hear what you are saying. I'm a hard gainer too. It seems that no matter what I do I can't seem to break 215 at 11% or 200 at 8%.

However, having read your last post I think you could gain much by radically increasing your food intake. If you have to do a shake in the am, make it 60 grams of protein, not 30. Add a mid-morning shake or other meal. Try to eat or have a shake every 2.5 or so hours.

Make sure you have a shake before bed, 50 grams of protein.

I think if you consume 300 grams protein, 300 grams carbs, and 100 grams of fat per day, you'll grow.

 

[Kim the Swede]

Hi this is the first time I try posting in this forum.
I am 25 yo at 5'9 , 145-150#. I have been working out for about 3 years, and I have achieved definition, but I want some BULK. I wanna gain at least 10-15 pounds. My confusiong is that I though Deca was a very safe steroid for the first cycle, but as I read the forum, it seems that Sustanon is the steroid of choice. I am aware of the post cycling use of clomid.

My questions are
1. How much should I expect to gain if I use sustanon
2. Is 250mg/week for 8 weeks good enough
3. Would it be better if I use deca with tes.

Thanks a LOT

Hi!
I am in a similar situation. I am also 25 years old work out of and on for about 5 years and i am 5ft10. I started at 130 and gained to 160 by working out like a half-ass and without proper diet. But one day I decided to kick ass. And I did a strict work out with strict food. And gained another 15lbs to 175. Now I think its hard to gain anymore, this because i have a very high metabolism.

I def think you can gain another 15lbs without using gear. But now, if you are at 150lbs and really want to do roids, 250mg/week is a good way to start i think. But i would up the dose to 500mg/week the first 2 weeks. And i wouldnt use deca with your testo. If this is your first cycle try to see how you body reacts to testo alone.

I have read about guys who have gained 25lbs on susta 250mg/week.

But if you are at 150lbs now I hardly think you have the proper diet, or you have a extreme high metabolism. And without proper diet, juice wont do you any good anyway.

 

[wannabmassive]

lets get to the 1st question id much perfer deca with a single easter test than Sustanon (sust). sust is only good if u run it eod too many times to be pinned if u ask me

 

[Kim the Swede]

I will run susta once a week, and i will tell you the results.

 

[Mind Over Matter]

In my humble opinion, a 5'9 150 25 year old should never even be considering using gear if you are looking to bulk up. If you've been trying to gain but haven't achieved weight gain results, you are doing something very wrong. Post your workout routine and your eating schedule, and we'll have a look.

 

[bowbow]

I think you need to eat almost twice as much as you said your eating and when your ready just do a test only cycle for ten weeks of either cyp or enanthate. Sust should be inj. more frequently. You could get away with just once a week with the others but twice would be better.