For those of you who dont aspirate...

[DocJ]

i should've used the word "tradition" rather than "procedure." the same thing goes with alcohol swabbing, it's totally unnecessary. there's no way an infection can occur by bacteria getting through the seal between your skin and the needle. ask any doctor these questions "off the record" and if they're honest, they'll tell you the same thing.

 

[lil g]

i should've used the word "tradition" rather than "procedure." the same thing goes with alcohol swabbing, it's totally unnecessary. there's no way an infection can occur by bacteria getting through the seal between your skin and the needle. ask any doctor these questions "off the record" and if they're honest, they'll tell you the same thing.

thats why my friend got an abcess in his glute a year and a half ago...no alcohol swabbing....and i guess sine u dont need to swab with the alcohol pad you can reuse the same pin and syringe ? cuts its just going through ur skin no problem...

 

[thetopdog]

thats why my friend got an abcess in his glute a year and a half ago...no alcohol swabbing....and i guess sine u dont need to swab with the alcohol pad you can reuse the same pin and syringe ? cuts its just going through ur skin no problem...

Just becusae your friend got an abscess when he didn't swab doesn't mean not swabbing was the cause of his abscess. There could be many other reasons

That said, I still think it's pretty stupid to not swab with alcohol before you inject

 

[bigdaddy22]

there's no way an infection can occur by bacteria getting through the seal between your skin and the needle. ask any doctor these questions "off the record" and if they're honest, they'll tell you the same thing.

Are you actually a doc, or just a basketball fan? In all honesty, I completely disagree with you concerning the inability to contract an infection from skin bacteria during an injection. I can think of multiple situations where you can get disease from an injection such as infective endocarditis from stap aureus from an IV injection just to name one. If you are not a real doc I think you should change your name because people are gonna take your word as if it is always the truth.

 

[kube]

thats one bad looking dog blasta. yours?

i always aspirate. if the needles already in then it cannot possibly hurt to aspirate. and why take more chances? ive hit veins and bled like a biatch, sometimes there is no blood when you aspirate but then theres a thick stream of blood upon removing the pin. never passed out, but the first few times i was pretty worried. it happens from time to time regardless of how anal you are about correct injection procedure. i wouldnt go so fara s to say youd be dead bro, although im sure its possible. all the more reason to do things right.

 

[DocJ]

no, he got it from unsterile gear....a big joke among nurses where my wife works is how they could save the hospital thousands of dollars per year simply by not swabbing becasue it's unecessary anyways. this isn't something that's open for debate, they actually telll med students in school this.

thats why my friend got an abcess in his glute a year and a half ago...no alcohol swabbing....and i guess sine u dont need to swab with the alcohol pad you can reuse the same pin and syringe ? cuts its just going through ur skin no problem...

 

[bigdaddy22]

. this isn't something that's open for debate, they actually telll med students in school this.

Hey bro, i am not trying to rain on your parade, but I am currently in my second year of school to be a Physician Assistant and take classes with med students and am taught by MD's and we are told that swabbing is ABSOLUTELY necessary. We get shit continuously if we touch a part of the skin that has previously been swabbed prior to injection, so you need to quit quoting that docs will tell you this or that.

 

[blaster]

Nah,

thats one bad looking dog blasta. yours?

i always aspirate. if the needles already in then it cannot possibly hurt to aspirate. and why take more chances? ive hit veins and bled like a biatch, sometimes there is no blood when you aspirate but then theres a thick stream of blood upon removing the pin. never passed out, but the first few times i was pretty worried. it happens from time to time regardless of how anal you are about correct injection procedure. i wouldnt go so fara s to say youd be dead bro, although im sure its possible. all the more reason to do things right.

Pit bulls are under BSL in Oz. You can't import them or breed them. It sucks. I just found the pic on the net. If you like Pit's go to:

http://www.dogwebz.com/pitbull/topsites.php

 

[DocJ]

i am a doc buddy and i'm telling you if you use good procedure in handling syringes swabbing does NOTHING to reduce the chance of infection. there isn't one single study that shows this. swab if it makes you feel better i don't care.

Hey bro, i am not trying to rain on your parade, but I am currently in my second year of school to be a Physician Assistant and take classes with med students and am taught by MD's and we are told that swabbing is ABSOLUTELY necessary. We get shit continuously if we touch a part of the skin that has previously been swabbed prior to injection, so you need to quit quoting that docs will tell you this or that.

 

[StoneColdNTO]

i am a doc buddy and i'm telling you if you use good procedure in handling syringes swabbing does NOTHING to reduce the chance of infection. there isn't one single study that shows this. swab if it makes you feel better i don't care.

....and if they average user does not use good procedure ??

Maybe you are a doctor and do everything perfect when it comes to injecting, but the point is; We are trying to teach guys how to stay safe as possible, and swabbing and aspirating are two things that help ensure their safety.

 

[DocJ]

point taken

....and if they average user does not use good procedure ??

Maybe you are a doctor and do everything perfect when it comes to injecting, but the point is; We are trying to teach guys how to stay safe as possible, and swabbing and aspirating are two things that help ensure their safety.

 

[bigdaddy22]

swabbing does NOTHING to reduce the chance of infection. there isn't one single study that shows this.

Well Dr!!! here is the first of many studies showing the importance of swabbing, and how it can prevent infection from the skin! The cath may be venous, but it is the same flora from the skin causing the infections that we possibly can get from IM injections as well.
Institution
Department of Internal Medicine I, University Medical Centre, University of Regensburg, 93042 Regensburg, Germany. julia.langgartner@klinik.uni-regensburg.de

Title
Combined skin disinfection with chlorhexidine/propanol and aqueous povidone-iodine reduces bacterial colonisation of central venous catheters.

Source
Intensive Care Medicine. 30(6):1081-8, 2004 Jun.

Abstract
OBJECTIVE: Central venous catheter (CVC)-related infections may be caused by micro-organisms introduced from the skin surface into deeper tissue at the time of CVC insertion. The optimal disinfection regimen to avoid catheter-related infections has not yet been defined. This study compares three different approaches. DESIGN: Prospective randomised trial. SETTING: A tertiary care hospital. PATIENTS AND PARTICIPANTS: One hundred nineteen patients scheduled electively to receive 140 CVCs. INTERVENTIONS: Skin disinfection was performed with either povidone-iodine 10% (PVP-iodine), chlorhexidine 0.5%/propanol 70%, or chlorhexidine 0.5%/propanol 70% followed by PVP-iodine 10%. Prior to disinfection, a swab from the site of insertion was taken for culture. CVCs were removed if no longer needed or infection was suspected. All catheters were cultured quantitatively after removal. MEASUREMENT AND RESULTS: Bacteria could be isolated from 20.7% of the catheter tips. Bacterial growth was found in 30.8% of the catheters placed after skin disinfection with povidone-iodine, in 24.4% after disinfection with propanol/chlorhexidine and in 4.7% after disinfection with propanol/chlorhexidine followed by povidone-iodine ( p=0.006). In 15 cases, the same organism was isolated from the skin swab and the catheter tip. Ten of these paired isolates showed the same pattern in a pulsed-field gel electrophoresis analysis. CONCLUSIONS: Skin disinfection with propanol/chlorhexidine followed by PVP-iodine was superior in the prevention of microbial CVC colonisation compared to either of the regimens alone. These results support the concept that catheter infections can originate from bacterial translocation at the time of catheter insertion.micro-organisms introduced from the skin surface into deeper tissue at the time of CVC insertion

 

[bigdaddy22]

I think the real importance here is that people need to swab just to be safe, not everyone out there is a medical professional using sterile technique when doing procedures. I am not trying to be an ass, but the safety of our bros on this board is important and the last thing we need is something happening to anyone on this board and giving steroid users a worse name than they already have in the publics eye.

 

[Neir305]

You can get an infection from a scratch, I can't figure out how sticking a needle 1.5' in couldn't give you one. If you break the skin, you can get an infection, and alcohol swabbing is proven to help kill bacteria that cause many such infections. I don't care how sterile the equipment is, who knows what kind of bacteria are crawlin around on the skin of your ASS.

 

[DocJ]

studies on catheters are a far cry from studies on IM injection.

listen...it was not my intention for everyone to get calivier/willy nilly with their injection techniques. find a safe technique and repeat it everytime and you'll be fine. my only point here was to allay the fears of some people. i can't tell you how many emails i've received from bros who were experiencing no symptoms but were ready to cal 911 because they think they may have injected 1/4 of a cc of air/oil into a vein.

 

[Popichulo]

i am a doc buddy and i'm telling you if you use good procedure in handling syringes swabbing does NOTHING to reduce the chance of infection. there isn't one single study that shows this. swab if it makes you feel better i don't care.

 

[Die$eL~Man]

Amen Lil G
Bros MUST aspirate, each and every time! Same thing happened to my quad shot last week...hit a nice vein and bled like a stuck pig after I aspirated. Saved my life perhaps, at the very least kept me from having an oil bolus in my lungs!

ive taken lots of shots in my life and not 1 of my docs / specialists EVER aspirated ! NEVER ! whats up with that ?

 

[Popichulo]

ive taken lots of shots in my life and not 1 of my docs / specialists EVER aspirated ! NEVER ! whats up with that ?

Their trying to kill you.

 

[Die$eL~Man]

I am an RN...and give more than 30 IM injections per week...for the last 8 years. I never aspirate. In school, we were told that it's an out of date practice. That if you inject in the proper sites, then your risk of hitting anything substantial is almost impossible, and if you've been giving injects for years, you should know how to site properly. I know, lots of people here have seen blood after aspirating and pulled out thinking they hit a vein or something. or they've seen blood literally squirt out of the site after removing the needle. What they don't know is that this is usually a sign that they have busted a small capillary will going in and it bleed briefly. the chances of hitting a vein or artery are almost nothing if you are going in the delts, glutes and quads. And the chances of actually hitting something and the needle remaining in the proper space to actually injcet into a vein is almost unthinkable. I would say you are at risk if you are going anyhere else (biceps). I recommend everybody who doesn't have professional experience to aspirate...but, in the my clinic...no RN's aspirate.

THANX FOR CLEARING THAT UP !.. I THINK SOME OF THESE BROS ARE INFATUATED WITH THE PROCESS OF INJECTION ! JUST GET IT DONE !

 

[Popichulo]

You guys ever heard of people injecting and then getting light headed and having to lie down or passing out? I have and I think it could maybe have been stopped if they asperated on their injection.