Going to have my first Nebido injection tomorrow morning. Expectations?

[DexterM]

Hi guys,

I have been diagnosed with low T. About 241 and I am a 24 year old male. I am going for my first Nebido injection tomorrow and I am very excited about it. I have some questions which I would be grateful if you guys could help me:
1) Is TRT going to help me grow better facial hair? I have some on my face but it's so thin and doesn't grow evenly everywhere.
2) I have a quite "feminine" body type with fats on my hips, breasts and very narrow chest. Is TRT going to help with that?
3) I have a very childish and feminine voice as well.
4) I have been dealing with a premature ejaculation issue for as far as I can remember.

Basically, I just want to know if TRT is going to help me in those areas, considering I have already passed the puberty age.

Thank you

 

[cybrsage]

TRT most likely will not help you with those things, at least not at the dosage you are likely to be taking. I would still go on it in a heartbeat. It will makes you FEEL much better.


EDIT: Wait a bit and see if someone corrects me. If I am wrong, someone will certainly say so and we will both learn something.

 

[DexterM]

TRT most likely will not help you with those things, at least not at the dosage you are likely to be taking. I would still go on it in a heartbeat. It will makes you FEEL much better.


EDIT: Wait a bit and see if someone corrects me. If I am wrong, someone will certainly say so and we will both learn something.

Oh, I do hope you're wrong. I was looking forward to it.

 

[Mprtz]

My opinion:

1) Yes
2) Maybe. Make sure estradiol is managed. Fat deposition and distribution is heavily influenced by sex hormones. You will not change your bone structure but androgen responsive musculature may help correct your body shape.
3) Maybe.
4) Probably not.

 

[IMT staff]

expect your Dr to put you on some ridiculous every 10 week shot schedule, and expect to feel like crap because of it.

Tell them you want every 2 week injects.

Yes your gonna have a lot more hair.

In situations like this it is actually possible to go on T for 6 months, come off and regain normal HPTA function.

Research "idiopathic hypogonadism"

CONCLUSIONS
Sustained reversal of normosmic idiopathic hypogonadotropic hypogonadism and the Kallmann syndrome was noted after discontinuation of treatment in about 10% of patients with either absent or partial puberty. Therefore, brief discontinuation of hormonal therapy to assess reversibility of hypogonadotropic hypogonadism is reasonable. (ClinicalTrials.gov number, NCT00392756.)

http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa066494

 

[cybrsage]

There you go, the experts chimed in. I was speaking from my personal experience. IMT especially, was speaking as a TRT provider...listen to IMT.

 

[DexterM]

expect your Dr to put you on some ridiculous every 10 week shot schedule, and expect to feel like crap because of it.

Tell them you want every 2 week injects.

Yes your gonna have a lot more hair.

In situations like this it is actually possible to go on T for 6 months, come off and regain normal HPTA function.

Research "idiopathic hypogonadism"



nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa066494

Im sorry for being such a newbie. Why would I feel like crap because of the 10 week shot schedule exactly?

 

[cybrsage]

Im sorry for being such a newbie. Why would I feel like crap because of the 10 week shot schedule exactly?

You will be given a big dose - it will slowly decay over time. Nebido has a LONG half-life, about 10 weeks. So in 10-12 weeks, your body will use up half the testosterone from the Nebido injection. The standard Nebido doses will normally be 1,000mg every 10-12 weeks. Most plans will call for a second 1,000mg dose to be applied 6 weeks after the first injection, and from there the standard 12 week protocol will follow. Here is one of the issues - your body could very well metabolize it faster than the average person does. We have someone on this board who is doing 1,000mg every 6 weeks (I think that is it) because any longer and he feels horrible. If you are like him, you will use up all the testosterone in the Nebido injection in 6 weeks and then you will drop back down to where you are now - or (most likely) lower than where you are now.

 

[DexterM]

My opinion:

1) Yes
2) Maybe. Make sure estradiol is managed. Fat deposition and distribution is heavily influenced by sex hormones. You will not change your bone structure but androgen responsive musculature may help correct your body shape.
3) Maybe.
4) Probably not.

Thanks Mprtz. Is there any off-counter pills I could use to manage Estradiol?

 

[sanipialo]

expect your Dr to put you on some ridiculous every 10 week shot schedule, and expect to feel like crap because of it.

Tell them you want every 2 week injects.

Nebido every 2 weeks is terrible advice!

The protocol (in most EU countries) is to first booster injection, then another injection after 6 weeks and a blood test plus consult after 12 weeks. Based on the blood test and consult the follow would be anywhere between 8 to 12 weeks. Followed by another blood test and consult after 6 months and with a possible adjustment to the frequency.

 

[IMT staff]

Nebido every 2 weeks is terrible advice!

The protocol (in most EU countries) is to first booster injection, then another injection after 6 weeks and a blood test plus consult after 12 weeks. Based on the blood test and consult the follow would be anywhere between 8 to 12 weeks. Followed by another blood test and consult after 6 months and with a possible adjustment to the frequency.

hahahah terrible advice? Says who? Nebido manufacturers? FYI Watson still says 50-200mg every 2-4 weeks on their bottle.

Instead let me ask you a question, if we can use the rule of 10 for cypionate and we assume Nebido ester length is twice as long (even though its more realistically about 12 days) or 14 days, then is it fair to say we can use the rule of 5 for Nebido?

So if I do 100mg of testosterone cypionate my levels should peak at about 1,000 ng/dl and drop to about 500 (+- 150) after 7 days since its roughly a 7 day half-life. What would 1,000 mg of Nebido hit on its peak? 5,000 ng/dl? Yikes

So lets say we wait 6 weeks. Our T levels should go down by half every 14 days. So they should drop to about 625 ng/dl ? Yea thats a good trough number but is it safe to range someone out like that? I can tell you absolutely not. It would be much safer to bring someone up to 1,500 -2,000 and drop them just under 1,000.

And guess what here are the benefits, you never raise their T levels to extremely unsafe levels AND their trough is ALWAYS higher.

Terrible advice pffft. You don't have a clue what I even just said so I don't expect you to understand.

PS we NEVER give terrible advice.

 

[Mprtz]

Thanks Mprtz. Is there any off-counter pills I could use to manage Estradiol?

I have read of people using DIM and zinc, but I have no experience with that.

 

[bigben66]

OK... Nebido patient here...

If you are in the EU, which I suspect you are, you will be given a Nebido injection of 1000mg/4ml by your practice nurse. You will then be recalled for a further 1000mg/4ml injection 6 weeks later. This a a booster.

You will then be asked to go for a series of blood tests at various durations to determine peak, trough and speed that the body metabolises the compound. Usually your doctor will start a 12 weekly injection protocol but he will assess along the way whether this needs to be reduced to 10, 8, 6 or at the most 4 weeks (IMT staff, I have never in all my research on Nebido users in the EU, heard of anyone on a fortnightly protocol - I wish I was!)

I am currently injecting 1000mg/4ml every 4 weeks, and this keeps me mid/high in the range.
EU docs will NOT consider HCG or AI's whatsoever - they will test for estrogen, but their response to high estrogen is to back off on the regularity of injections - NOT issue an AI. I had to go to an UGL for AI (Adex) and my HCG. I have worked out my protocol with these two compounds by trial and error. (It is nigh on impossible to find a private blood clinic in the UK)

Hope this helps OP - Bear in mind 99% of the advice you get on this forum will be from US citizens - which although it will be extremely helpful - mostly won't be appropriate in the EU - hit me up if you have any queries.

Welcome to 'Ology brother!

BigBen

 

[IMT staff]

(IMT staff, I have never in all my research on Nebido users in the EU, heard of anyone on a fortnightly protocol - I wish I was!)

I understand completely what they are doing, this does not mean it is the best way. Which it definitely is not, as I pointed out in my earlier post.

I understand you can only do what they will let you which is fine, but 1,000 mg every 4 weeks is skyrocketing your T levels and eventually you will have problems with polycythemia, decreased HDL and possibly BPH.

This is because they are giving you 1,000mg in one shot and your peak levels are going way higher than they ever need to be.

 

[IMT staff]

This may be primarily because most do not understand esters and how they are cleaved, it doesn't matter what ester you use your T levels should peak within 48 hours. At this point they peak out and slowly fall over the following days/weeks dependant on the half-life of the ester. Most tend to believe they build slowly from a single injection, this is not the case.

You guys over there have an uphill battle ahead of you in regards to Nebido, just as we started with monthly injections of test cyp and had to teach our doctors that is not the best way to do it.

Based on half-life and ester weight, I'm guessing 3-400mg every 2 weeks would be the sweet spot for most.

 

[bigben66]

I understand you can only do what they will let you which is fine, but 1,000 mg every 4 weeks is skyrocketing your T levels and eventually you will have problems with polycythemia, decreased HDL and possibly BPH.

This is because they are giving you 1,000mg in one shot and your peak levels are going way higher than they ever need to be.

So you'd recommend taking 500mg every 2 weeks rather 1000mg every 4?
If you were me that is...

I'm a big bloke and apparently I metabolise it quicker than the average guy...
(Endo's words, not mine)

 

[IMT staff]

of course

there is no need to shoot your T levels so high, the fluctuations in T levels are what cause side effects more so than the levels themselves.

Think of a young man going through puberty.

I bet your pinging at least 4k with that shot after 10 weeks of being on.

redlining it, if that makes sense.

Edit: after 20 weeks due to dosing schedule.

 

[IMT staff]

500 hundred I bet would drop you in right about 1k plus or minus a lil with a peak around 2k.

 

[IMT staff]

I'm a big bloke and apparently I metabolise it quicker than the average guy...
(Endo's words, not mine)

of course there are individual cases where people need more. but long term, 120-170 seems to be the dose for test cyp. Undecanoate is a bit heavier so you will get less T with Nebido mg per mg.

So what are your peak and trough levels? where were they measured in comparison to your shot?

How long were you on it when you got these?

 

[bigben66]

Thanks for your advice... I'll halve my dose and double the frequency