Gyno reversal on TRT (still taking AI)

[bigben66]

It will reduce it to the point where you do not notice it.

Thanks Jimi....

I think if you asked 100 gyno sufferers, they'd snap your hands off at a 90% improvement in symptoms rather than go under the knife. I know I would.

FWIW: Tamoxifen reduced my gyno to nothing.

I'm competing in 8 weeks and will hopefully be mid single figures bf% for that show.
I am confident that I will have zero signs of ever having suffered with gyno at that bf%.

 

[.Vision.]

No man, its on adult males and it has an example of elimination of gyno in a group of 11 examples. The rest show a reduction avg of like 63% if i recall. Its been a while but i think my numbers are accurate.
Also google the ralox studies on pre pubertal gyno, they have examples of elimination as well >THATS really impressive actually because in those cases the gyno was formed pre puberty and still responded to treatment with ralox YEARS later.
Of course ralox will not make gyno disappear every time. In fact most of the time it wont. It will reduce it to the point where you do not notice it. That being said there are situations and examples where it does and has eliminated it completely. The reason being iss that the tissue requires estrogen not just to form but to survive and if it can effectively be deprived of e2 for an extenuated period it is possible for apoptsis to occur and it is gone.

Great study man, deff worth adding to the files... awesome share...

It's impress that it shown that a good amount had reduction (this is exactly what we want), and the selective few had instances of the tissue disappearing ( but those few weren't hypogondal ),nonetheless that's still a breakthrough considering the generation of drugs that we have avail...

Im very prone myself so any development in this dept is huge for me.. I wish studies would do more follow-ups..

(( observational study suggests that raloxifene may be a safe,
well tolerated and effective therapeutic alternative for drug-induced or
idiopathic gynaecomastia in men of all ages. )) although it's an older study 2003, it's more up to date then something from the 60's..

 

[.Vision.]

Thanks Jimi....

I think if you asked 100 gyno sufferers, they'd snap your hands off at a 90% improvement in symptoms rather than go under the knife. I know I would.

FWIW: Tamoxifen reduced my gyno to nothing.

I'm competing in 8 weeks and will hopefully be mid single figures bf% for that show.
I am confident that I will have zero signs of ever having suffered with gyno at that bf%.

Tamox is an amzing drug, I swear by it... I concur 110% that people would be floored at any opportunity to see improvement.. I feel for anyone that has to under go the knife

 

[oldmusclemike]

.... A very good thread regarding Gyno treatment to reduce and stop symptoms. .......

 

[Dreaded Pirate Roberts]

Ok so lets be clear....I was the first one in the bodybuilding world to document the reversal of full blown Gyno in 2002 after switching from Arminidex to the use of Lertozole. Letrozole was new in the bodybuilding world at the time. It was noted ver quickly after Lion Nutrition released it that it was reversing gone left over from puberty also.People who were carrying fatty deposits from estrogen related sides were loosing belly fat and the baby fat porker were thinning out to. At the time it was common practice to jump on Tamoxifen to fill up your estogen receptors till an Aromatise inhibitor could be administered.

The Tamoxifen was never and has never had the ability to completely starve the gland of estrogen witch is what it take to the gland and reverse gyno.

 

[Mrrippedzilla]

Ok so lets be clear....I was the first one in the bodybuilding world to document the reversal of full blown Gyno in 2002 after switching from Arminidex to the use of Lertozole. Letrozole was new in the bodybuilding world at the time. It was noted ver quickly after Lion Nutrition released it that it was reversing gone left over from puberty also.People who were carrying fatty deposits from estrogen related sides were loosing belly fat and the baby fat porker were thinning out to. At the time it was common practice to jump on Tamoxifen to fill up your estogen receptors till an Aromatise inhibitor could be administered.

The Tamoxifen was never and has never had the ability to completely starve the gland of estrogen witch is what it take to the gland and reverse gyno.

Your wrong, again.
Tamoxifen has been used successfully to reduce gyno since the 80s:

[Influence of size and duration of gynecomastia on its response to treatment with tamoxifen]. - PubMed - NCBI
- 6 months of Tamoxifen at 20mg per day eliminated gyno in 62% of the group (26/43).

[Testosterone and estradiol levels in male gynecomastia. Clinical and endocrine findings during treatment with tamoxifen]. - PubMed - NCBI
- 20mg/day for 2-4 months = "Gynaecomastia regressed partially or completely in 14 patients, in only 2 was it unchanged. There was no recurrence of gynaecomastia after discontinuing tamoxifen. Side-effects did not occur. It is concluded that tamoxifen is a promising alternative to the surgical treatment of gynaecomastia."

Idiopathic gynecomastia treated with tamoxifen: a preliminary report. - PubMed - NCBI
- 40 mg/day of tamoxifen for 1-4 months results in 80% complete regression of gyno with no long-term side effects observed over a follow-up period of 36 months.

There are a lot more studies showing the successful reduction of gyno through tamoxifen treatment if you wish for me to continue
It's also commonly prescribed in the UK by the NHS for gyno treatment and there is plenty of anecdotal evidence across the forums showing its success.

 

[Megatron28]

Here is a great thread on Gyno from one of our moderators. It includes studies.

http://www.steroidology.com/forum/a...ia-if-you-re-asking-question-read-thread.html

 

[Black Beard]

The thing is, letrozole can treat breast cancer. You can starve hormone sensitive tissues with drugs. Finasteride/dutasteride can literally shrink the prostate and treat BPH and prostate CA.



If you think of gyno as a kind of hormone sensitive tissue overgrowth like prostate hyperplasia, letrozole shrinking the gyno starts to make sense.




You add anecdotes and studies, there's a strong case for letrozole protocols for killing gyno, especially at an early stage.

 

[tbonexl]

The thing is, letrozole can treat breast cancer. You can starve hormone sensitive tissues with drugs. Finasteride/dutasteride can literally shrink the prostate and treat BPH and prostate CA.



If you think of gyno as a kind of hormone sensitive tissue overgrowth like prostate hyperplasia, letrozole shrinking the gyno starts to make sense.




You add anecdotes and studies, there's a strong case for letrozole protocols for killing gyno, especially at an early stage.

Also at a risk of crushing estrogen which serms do not do...

 

[Megatron28]

The thing is, letrozole can treat breast cancer. You can starve hormone sensitive tissues with drugs. Finasteride/dutasteride can literally shrink the prostate and treat BPH and prostate CA.



If you think of gyno as a kind of hormone sensitive tissue overgrowth like prostate hyperplasia, letrozole shrinking the gyno starts to make sense.




You add anecdotes and studies, there's a strong case for letrozole protocols for killing gyno, especially at an early stage.

Letro nukes all estrogen in the body whereas Ralox/Tamox are more like a sniper rifle IMHO.

 

[juced_porkchop]

The thing is, letrozole can treat breast cancer. You can starve hormone sensitive tissues with drugs. Finasteride/dutasteride can literally shrink the prostate and treat BPH and prostate CA.



If you think of gyno as a kind of hormone sensitive tissue overgrowth like prostate hyperplasia, letrozole shrinking the gyno starts to make sense.




You add anecdotes and studies, there's a strong case for letrozole protocols for killing gyno, especially at an early stage.

and what is Tamox and clomid used for? breast cancer no?

crashing your whole bodies estrogen with an AI when you can be site specific with a SERM just makes more sense.. does both work? yes, thats not the argument...

 

[Black Beard]

We need to KILL the man boobies. NUKE THEM

 

[Milton]

Hows it going so far?

 

[Black Beard]

Nolva has more data behind it. Seems anecdotes for letrozole reversing gyno are quite sparse and there's only one study and only on rats.

 

[Dreaded Pirate Roberts]

Your wrong, again.
Tamoxifen has been used successfully to reduce gyno since the 80s:

[Influence of size and duration of gynecomastia on its response to treatment with tamoxifen]. - PubMed - NCBI
- 6 months of Tamoxifen at 20mg per day eliminated gyno in 62% of the group (26/43).

[Testosterone and estradiol levels in male gynecomastia. Clinical and endocrine findings during treatment with tamoxifen]. - PubMed - NCBI
- 20mg/day for 2-4 months = "Gynaecomastia regressed partially or completely in 14 patients, in only 2 was it unchanged. There was no recurrence of gynaecomastia after discontinuing tamoxifen. Side-effects did not occur. It is concluded that tamoxifen is a promising alternative to the surgical treatment of gynaecomastia."

Idiopathic gynecomastia treated with tamoxifen: a preliminary report. - PubMed - NCBI
- 40 mg/day of tamoxifen for 1-4 months results in 80% complete regression of gyno with no long-term side effects observed over a follow-up period of 36 months.

There are a lot more studies showing the successful reduction of gyno through tamoxifen treatment if you wish for me to continue
It's also commonly prescribed in the UK by the NHS for gyno treatment and there is plenty of anecdotal evidence across the forums showing its success.

I'm not to big to admitt when I wrong. I clearly was wrong in this case. I will say in the land of practical application we have a wide volume of letrozole reversing gyno and doing it very effectivly. There is very little documentation of tamoxifen being successful in the bodybuilding world. I'd also like to point out that in all of the studies posted the testosterone and Esteogen levels were not hyper elevated due to steroid uses. This is why it hasn't been documented with cycling men. Letrozole is like dropping a nuke of the estrogen it has the ability to shut it down systemically but with the proper adjustments it can be Gaged to achieve the desired effect without crashing levels.