High Estrogen with Low estrogen sides????

[Veefrag]

Estrogen has been silently ruining my life for a long time and I have had no idea until now. I'm posting this because I have scavenged the internet for months and not found anything that would lead me to believe it was high estrogen that was ruining me. Let me start with my stats and history.

I'm 26yo, 6'1", 225lbs, 20ish percent BF, been training consistently for 6 years. I am currently on my 4th cycle.

I started taking steroids because I had been training hard for 5 years with little to no results, so I got bloodwork done and my test total was at 350 and my estrogen total was at 250.

From the begining, I always struggled with my doses of arimadex (I am predisposed to high Estrogen, but struggled to afford bloodwork). On my first cycle ever, 500mg Enanthate a week, I would take .5mg AI, twice a week, this was too much (could have been bunk testosterone). I got achy and when I would train, I felt like I had a tear in my quad. I stopped the arimadex and went back to feeling good within days, no pain at all. I gained maybe 5 lbs this cycle...

Cycle 2, 8 week, 600mg T Cyp. E/W, little to no AI, different brand of Test. Feel great first month, then I start getting gyno, take half an arimadex, gyno is gone, so I finish my cycle without more AI. ( At this point I keep hearing if you don't notice gyno, don't worry about AI) I get about half the results of my friends taking the same stuff, and even with decent PCT, barely retain any.

During my second cycle I got my dream GM job for a small restaurant and bar that I loved. My inability to think clearly an make decisions (I have had ADD but it has never been this bad before) caused me to loose that job in two months. I was seeing doctors, trying to figure out whats wrong with me, why can't I think clearly... "well seems like your bad sleep (sinus issues) are causing it" ok whatever doc

Cycle 3, 12week, I add deca into the mix. 600mg E/W test cyp., 300mg E/W deca. Get bloods done for test only 2700, 2 weeks in. Little to no AI for the whole cycle, Ill take maybe .25mg EOW. Cool. End up Gaining 20 lbs, half muscle. No gyno. Perfect.

Towards the end of cycle 3, every time I hang in the pull-up position, I feel a sharp pain in my right arm, where my tricep meets my back, this pain gets worse over a few weeks, then gets better for a few weeks.. but during PCT ends up staying.. Physical Therapist says get an MRI, seems like a tear (but I didnt injure it...)

PCT HCG 2500iu E/W for 2 weeks
Clomid 40,20,20,20
(cant do nolva because of deca)


Then off for 2 months ( I would take about .25mg AI E3W during this) loose all the gains...

have a belly at this point and have the same strength I had when I started my first cycle, very discouraging.

During all this, I never had any libido issues, never emotional, never had any high estrogen side effects. Besides fatigue. But I did have low estrogen side effects the whole time, joint pain, muscle pain (tricep and other petty issues), joint popping, fatigue, excessive sleep etc. Am having some pretty bad depression but don't think much of it.

So at this point im over it, Tren it is...

Start cycle 4
40mg Tren A ED
30mg Test Prop ED

Start this cycle and feel great mentally 3 days in, still got the worst ADD ive ever had...and more achy than ever... but I feel pumped.
Day 4, go fork over the money for a blood test, then go home... "Tren Flu" kicks in..towards the evening I lay down and I can barely move, everything is tight I feel sicker than shit.
Day 5 same.. sick to my stomach, All test results came back normal... But under estrogen section it said "Estrogen Total results will follow"
Day 6, feel better, no more tren or propinate...took a shot of Sustenon250, no estrogen results yet..
Day 7, feel good. No results.
Day 8, Lab results are inView attachment 564981

Today is day 11. I haven't been able to workout my Back for months because of my tricep pain, now I have been regularly taking arimadex and the pain is finally gone. I have no signs of ADD, I can think clearly and actually get things done. (I have been in a new job for months and couldn't get anything done because of inability to focus). Before in a meeting, I'm studdering and cant complete sentences(even on a shit ton of Test), now im in there controlling the meetings with confidence.

So moral of the story is, high estrogen sides can be the exact same as low estrogen sides, if something doesnt feel right, get bloodwork done. If you dont have gyno that doesnt mean you dont have high estrogen. Do not make the same mistakes I did. I lost my dream job, and almost lost my backup job. 100% because of this silent Estrogen.

 

[Gainjin260]

Welcome to the board.

So moral of the story is, high estrogen sides can be the exact same as low estrogen sides, if something doesnt feel right, get bloodwork done. If you dont have gyno that doesnt mean you dont have high estrogen. Do not make the same mistakes I did. I lost my dream job, and almost lost my backup job. 100% because of this silent Estrogen

Not quite.

The moral of the story is that blood work is necessary during and after every cycle regardless of how you feel. If you're natty, then pre cycle blood work is critical.

If you cannot afford blood work then you shouldn't run a cycle.

There are certainly other lessons to be learned from your story, but this is paramount.

 

[oldmusclemike]

omg

 

[Teutonic]

Cajin nailed it

 

[luckypaul]

PED's are no game. Thanks for the post brother. It is best to learn from others mistakes, but second best is to allow others to learn from ours if we didn't get it right.

There are so many variables from bunk ai's and serms to our own individual responses to aas, that it is really hard to know with any certainty when we have problems like you are describing to know the exact cause. Good to hear things are improving for you.

 

[jozifp103]

FYI....tren is known to give a false e2 reading. I'd be willing to bet your e2 is not really over 1000. Probably not even close.

 

[halfwit]

FYI....tren is known to give a false e2 reading. I'd be willing to bet your e2 is not really over 1000. Probably not even close.

That, and we're looking at TOTAL ESTROGENS. That number is meaningless as it's estradiol that has any effect on us.

OP:
I don't honestly know where you got the idea that joint pain of that nature is necessarily low estradiol related, but it's usually from poor form or too much growth too quickly. It's load bearing joints that see the low E2 sides the most (knees/hips).

I see a lot of mistakes here, and it sounds like you've gotten a ton or shit advice in the past. Stick around, read the FAQ, and we'll have you good to go in no time.

Btw, it's the sides you can't see or feel that are the ones to worst about. Osteoporosis/prostatitis/DVT/polycythemia vera/etc are all affected by estradiol, and are all serious - yet we can't tell if they're going on until it's pretty late.

My .02c

 

[SJC]

So after all those cycles you only got bloodwork once? Then you get it testes and its the wrong test?

 

[jozifp103]

That, and we're looking at TOTAL ESTROGENS. That number is meaningless as it's estradiol that has any effect on us.

OP:
I don't honestly know where you got the idea that joint pain of that nature is necessarily low estradiol related, but it's usually from poor form or too much growth too quickly. It's load bearing joints that see the low E2 sides the most (knees/hips).

I see a lot of mistakes here, and it sounds like you've gotten a ton or shit advice in the past. Stick around, read the FAQ, and we'll have you good to go in no time.

Btw, it's the sides you can't see or feel that are the ones to worst about. Osteoporosis/prostatitis/DVT/polycythemia vera/etc are all affected by estradiol, and are all serious - yet we can't tell if they're going on until it's pretty late.

My .02c

Ah yes. Missed that. Seems there's quite a bit of misinformation here.