How To Keep Gains After A Cycle?

[rebelbodybuilder]

maybe you guys can help me... after i finisha cycle where do i go from there? hcg?nolvadex/clomid? also when would i start using the axcillary drugs.... during or after my cycle?? what worked best for you to keep your gains-(ADVICE NEEDED)!

 

[Slayer]

You have to do a proper post cycle therapy (pct) with either Nolva or clomid or both. Its best to run Hcg throughout the cycle or just before starting post cycle therapy (pct). But IMO the key to keeping gains is continuing to eat large for a month or two post cycle, train heavy, and reduce your volume a bit. It has worked for me.

 

[Vegas]

also when would i start using the axcillary drugs.... during or after my cycle??

What compounds are you running?

 

[rebelbodybuilder]

test e..... i thought about some clomid and nolva at the end

 

[Golgo13]

Eventually all the gains will go away. If you are at your genetic potential, thats all your natural test level will hold, eventually you will just return to that.

Steroids don't make you perminantly huge or anything.

Perhaps after YEARS and YEARS of cycles, tendons (supporting structure) will grow and will perminantly facilitate the ability to hold more muscle, but there is no way that a person can just do one cycle and keep it all, or really any of it for any practical amount of time.

I get the feeling you are thinking you can just do one cycle "GET HUGE" and then "GO NATURAL" but it doesn't work that way.

 

[Inquirer]

So what are we talking about, loss of all in months or over years

 

[gilreuven]

Eventually all the gains will go away. If you are at your genetic potential, thats all your natural test level will hold, eventually you will just return to that.

Steroids don't make you perminantly huge or anything.

Perhaps after YEARS and YEARS of cycles, tendons (supporting structure) will grow and will perminantly facilitate the ability to hold more muscle, but there is no way that a person can just do one cycle and keep it all, or really any of it for any practical amount of time.

I get the feeling you are thinking you can just do one cycle "GET HUGE" and then "GO NATURAL" but it doesn't work that way.

I didnt use any AS for 2 years and kept 50% of all gains im 23 though
started another cycle 2 months ago and grew 14 pounds proper post cycle therapy (pct) always work at the right age

 

[massive]

I found that after post cycle therapy (pct) take a quality creatine to hold on to as much water and muscle as possible. I kept nearly all of my gains before going on to my next cycle.

 

[Inquirer]

Eventually all the gains will go away. If you are at your genetic potential, thats all your natural test level will hold, eventually you will just return to that.

Steroids don't make you perminantly huge or anything.

Perhaps after YEARS and YEARS of cycles, tendons (supporting structure) will grow and will perminantly facilitate the ability to hold more muscle, but there is no way that a person can just do one cycle and keep it all, or really any of it for any practical amount of time.

I get the feeling you are thinking you can just do one cycle "GET HUGE" and then "GO NATURAL" but it doesn't work that way.

So if thats the case, why are we doing this again

 

[Uk Boy]

Eventually all the gains will go away. If you are at your genetic potential, thats all your natural test level will hold, eventually you will just return to that.

Steroids don't make you perminantly huge or anything.

Perhaps after YEARS and YEARS of cycles, tendons (supporting structure) will grow and will perminantly facilitate the ability to hold more muscle, but there is no way that a person can just do one cycle and keep it all, or really any of it for any practical amount of time.

I get the feeling you are thinking you can just do one cycle "GET HUGE" and then "GO NATURAL" but it doesn't work that way.

Well put.

 

[Golgo13]

So if thats the case, why are we doing this again

I am test deficient, so I am in this for better health... But as I said, I am in this for the long haul so changing the tendons and supporting structure is a part of my goal.

 

[Inquirer]

Glad to hear there are some legit purposes to all of thise, aside of temporary vanity such as myself. Take care bro

 

[biggest loser fat loss]

Staying on longer seems to help my body to get used to the added size. Then when I come off and run post cycle therapy (pct) it all doesnt melt away. Of course the proper diet and training is 99 percent of the "keeping it" part. My 2 cents...

 

[Jacky_Zebsten]

if you eventually lose all your gains... whats the point of Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) then?

 

[The Alchemist]

"Perminent" gains

Eventually all the gains will go away. If you are at your genetic potential, thats all your natural test level will hold, eventually you will just return to that.

Steroids don't make you perminantly huge or anything.

WHAT? Hey mate, I think you are a bit off base here.

I know many many athletes and bodybuilders who have maintained Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) augmented size and strenth for upto 30 years after they stopped cycling. Some have remained on HRT to keep a high normal (under 1000 ng/dl) level of test in the body, but believe me they are still big and strong, much more so than they ever would have been without using AAS. Some gains are temporary due to the extra h2o, glucose, etc. while cycling, but all your new muscle is not simply going to disappear once a cycle is over (with proper PCT) if you continue with proper diet and training. And, if you have a good foundation of natural training, you will keep even more gains.

For instance, in my mid 20's I weighted about 170 lbs after 3-4 years of dedicated natural training. I eventually worked my way up to a sold 240 lbs (at 12% bf) in the early 1990's after cycling a range of compounds. I lost some interest in training after an injury and was only able to lift 2 days/week max for the next 6 years in the mid-late 1990's, while I was completing my graduate education. Even so, my weight stabalized at 205 (14%). And this is with minimal training - If I had been more dedicated to training, who knows. Now, in my 40's, I'm working on bringing my lean wt up a bit and plan to run a few compounds (after 10 years Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) free).

Obviously, you will waste away if you are completely sedentary (which I was not) and have a terrible diet (which I did not), or over train or starve away your gains on a low carb (or other fad) diet; but, otherwise a good deal of the gains should stay with you.

In my opnion, individuals not able to keep at least 30% of their gains in mass and strength after a 10 - 14 wk cycle are doing something wrong! For one thing, they are probably confusing water retention with real tissue gains. This may not apply to a few rare genetically small/skinny bros (or to very high level athletes who are way above their genetic limit), but this applys to anyone with average genetics (like myself) or better.

Cheers --

 

[Golgo13]

WHAT? Hey mate, I think you are a bit off base here.

I know many many athletes and bodybuilders who have maintained Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) augmented size and strenth for upto 30 years after they stopped cycling. Some have remained on HRT to keep a high normal (under 1000 ng/dl) level of test in the body, but believe me they are still big and strong, much more so than they ever would have been without using AAS. Some gains are temporary due to the extra h2o, glucose, etc. while cycling, but all your new muscle is not simply going to disappear once a cycle is over (with proper PCT) if you continue with proper diet and training. And, if you have a good foundation of natural training, you will keep even more gains.

For instance, in my mid 20's I weighted about 170 lbs after 3-4 years of dedicated natural training. I eventually worked my way up to a sold 240 lbs (at 12% bf) in the early 1990's after cycling a range of compounds. I lost some interest in training after an injury and was only able to lift 2 days/week max for the next 6 years in the mid-late 1990's, while I was completing my graduate education. Even so, my weight stabalized at 205 (14%). And this is with minimal training - If I had been more dedicated to training, who knows. Now, in my 40's, I'm working on bringing my lean wt up a bit and plan to run a few compounds (after 10 years Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) free).

Obviously, you will waste away if you are completely sedentary (which I was not) and have a terrible diet (which I did not), or over train or starve away your gains on a low carb (or other fad) diet; but, otherwise a good deal of the gains should stay with you.

In my opnion, individuals not able to keep at least 30% of their gains in mass and strength after a 10 - 14 wk cycle are doing something wrong! For one thing, they are probably confusing water retention with real tissue gains. This may not apply to a few rare genetically small/skinny bros (or to very high level athletes who are way above their genetic limit), but this applys to anyone with average genetics (like myself) or better.

Cheers --

I'd be willing to bet that 205 @14% you could have achieved naturally. We won't eve know though.

 

[The Alchemist]

I'd be willing to bet that 205 @14% you could have achieved naturally. We won't eve know though.

Ur point is well taken, maybe after 10 years of natural training I could have achieved 205 at 14% bf (from 170 lbs & 15% bf at baseline), where as I (like others) was able to do this (go from 170 to 205) within one yr with moderate AAS.

I think ur point is a bit different. Perhaps u r saying the amount of gains retained post cycle is dependent on ur natural genetic limit for muscle mass? In my case, u suggest my natural limit may be 205 (or greater), thus I have been able to stay at this weight. I think my point is a bit different.

People seem to think it is NOT possible to MAINTAIN gains acheive with AAS, and I disagree with this premis. People should be able to maintain much (not all or most) of the gains on Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) over the long-term. In my case, during 7 years with minimal weight training (6 years 1-2 days/wk and 1 year with none at all), I was able to MAINTAIN over 20 lbs of muscle that I had gained while training with AAS! I'll bet I could have maintained even more of it had I been able to train more (and been able to sleep more as well).

Simply put - muscle can be maintained at significantly lower hormone levels than needed to build it (so long as other catabolic factors are not at play). In other words, one should be able to keep a good deal of muscle gained with the assistance of Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) with a NORMAL physiologic level testosterone. Do you believe otherwise?

 

[Golgo13]

I am saying that if someone is at their genetic limit (what any responsible person should be at before they start AAS), they can't hold more muscle than that after a cycle for an extended period of time.

Look at pro (AAS) athletes. They shrink when they retire, but it doesn't mean they will turn in to little girls.

 

[The Alchemist]

I am saying that if someone is at their genetic limit (what any responsible person should be at before they start AAS), they can't hold more muscle than that after a cycle for an extended period of time.

Look at pro (AAS) athletes. They shrink when they retire, but it doesn't mean they will turn in to little girls.

Actually, it depends upon what kind of pro athletes u r talking about. Body-builders may shrink, but most football and basketball players get bigger when they retire because they get big and fat from inactivity. Most do not continue to eat and train properly when they retire.

I get ur point, but the notion of a "genetic limit" is not a particularly useful construct here. Indeed, Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) and GH actually change your genetics so your phenotype after using is different than if you had never used. Weight training and other types of regular exercise (or other behavior 4 that matter) also changes your genetics. Each generation of new cells (or totally new cell growth that never would have existed, as in the case of neurogenesis), has a different "genetic code," due in part to the environment in which the cell was created and in which it exists. These new cells may express various receptors, proteins, neurotransmitters, growth factors, etc., different from prior cells. So our genetic potential is not fixed in stone.