TryinToGetStrong
New member
My first cycle was Sust, and that was it. It was fine, and I gained plenty.
My next I added Dbol. This cycle was better, but my Test dosage was higher.
I've never messed with anything else.
My first cycle. Test/Tbol cycle
- Thread starter Micki420
- Start date
My first cycle was Sust, and that was it. It was fine, and I gained plenty.
My next I added Dbol. This cycle was better, but my Test dosage was higher.
I've never messed with anything else.
oldmusclemike
New member
OP you've gotten good and true advice so far. Sorry I'm late in your game here.
Not much to add but to help your knowledge.
You mentioned adding a kicker to add more gains. Well that's not gonna happen at your point of entry.
You have plenty of weeks to gain LMM. If you cycle correctly, diet right on and your training, you should look for a 4-6 pound gain in LMM.
The only gain above that will most probably be just water.
So it was not needed and could of waited for another cycle placement and NEED.
There are good reasons , beyond you current understanding as to why we preach to follow Tue beginners cycle protocol.
OMM
Not much to add but to help your knowledge.
You mentioned adding a kicker to add more gains. Well that's not gonna happen at your point of entry.
You have plenty of weeks to gain LMM. If you cycle correctly, diet right on and your training, you should look for a 4-6 pound gain in LMM.
The only gain above that will most probably be just water.
So it was not needed and could of waited for another cycle placement and NEED.
There are good reasons , beyond you current understanding as to why we preach to follow Tue beginners cycle protocol.
OMM
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Thank you for your input. The information I have received already has been amazing and extremely helpful. I’m looking to gain 10 pounds on cycle in 12 weeks of LBM. My diet is extremely clean and I’m still getting only leaner right now before going on cycle.
Are you saying since you hyper-react to new compounds it’s almost no point adding a oral kickstart because you hyper-react to the test first anyway and get gains from it? Then the next cycle you’re going to somewhat “hyper-react” to the oral and get even more gains from the oral and test the second cycle? Please chime in your expertise!
oldmusclemike
New member
Damn this is hard to keep up with on this fvckin phone... My problem 
Now Micki I could go on further with the explaining to you but I don't think you understand the building of muscle yet.
In this I mean just how long it takes to build real LMM. maybe I do didn't explain to you or you just don't get that you can certainly put on 10, 20 plus pounds on a 12 week cycle but it all will not be LMM. It will be.mostly water
And we all like to get big but its what you want to be , and so look like. A lean hard body or a dough boy. No offense I've done that... Been there and it was fun.
Now in short, damn here I go again ! In general
A man can only build 15 -20/lbs of LMM.... That is LEAN MUSCLE MASS in one year... 12-14/months.
There are variables in those numbers but basically that's it.
So you may put on your 10 pounds in 12 weeks but JUST UNDERSTAND, it will be mostly 4-6 pounds of LMM and 4-5-6 pounds of water. This will be subcutaneous water, or basically ,depending on what you want it is unwanted water weight.
But as to your last Q's there are more reasons you don'tnt want or need the other compounds for cycle 1 and 2 at least.. You did hit on one.
OMM
Now Micki I could go on further with the explaining to you but I don't think you understand the building of muscle yet.
In this I mean just how long it takes to build real LMM. maybe I do didn't explain to you or you just don't get that you can certainly put on 10, 20 plus pounds on a 12 week cycle but it all will not be LMM. It will be.mostly water
And we all like to get big but its what you want to be , and so look like. A lean hard body or a dough boy. No offense I've done that... Been there and it was fun.
Now in short, damn here I go again
! In generalA man can only build 15 -20/lbs of LMM.... That is LEAN MUSCLE MASS in one year... 12-14/months.
There are variables in those numbers but basically that's it.
So you may put on your 10 pounds in 12 weeks but JUST UNDERSTAND, it will be mostly 4-6 pounds of LMM and 4-5-6 pounds of water. This will be subcutaneous water, or basically ,depending on what you want it is unwanted water weight.
But as to your last Q's there are more reasons you don'tnt want or need the other compounds for cycle 1 and 2 at least.. You did hit on one.
OMM
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Damn this is hard to keep up with on this fvckin phone... My problem
Now Micki I could go on further with the explaining to you but I don't think you understand the building of muscle yet.
In this I mean just how long it takes to build real LMM. maybe I do didn't explain to you or you just don't get that you can certainly put on 10, 20 plus pounds on a 12 week cycle but it all will not be LMM. It will be.mostly water
And we all like to get big but its what you want to be , and so look like. A lean hard body or a dough boy. No offense I've done that... Been there and it was fun.
Now in short, damn here I go again
A man can only build 15 -20/lbs of LMM.... That is LEAN MUSCLE MASS in one year... 12-14/months.
There are variables in those numbers but basically that's it.
So you may put on your 10 pounds in 12 weeks but JUST UNDERSTAND, it will be mostly 4-6 pounds of LMM and 4-5-6 pounds of water. This will be subcutaneous water, or basically ,depending on what you want it is unwanted water weight.
But as to your last Q's there are more reasons you don'tnt want or need the other compounds for cycle 1 and 2 at least.. You did hit on one.
OMM
Thank you mike for your input. I have personally seen an individual go from 155-160 to 178 and went from 9%bf to 11-12%bf. I think that’s an extremely strict diet and cardio process. He is currently in PCT. so, I would love to see how much he keeps after with him sticking to his diet.
I am worried about cycling at 15% bf because I’m worried I’ll get looking like a puff daddy with the muscle mass under the fat on top of any water retention. I think I will continue to cut until atleast 12% bf over the next 4-6.
Have you seen fat lose and LMM gain at 15% at a 300/250/80 Marcos during a first cycle?
They're not mutually exclusive bro. You can gain LMM, fat AND water retention all at the same time.
Anyhow, I started this cycle at 16% bodyfat, I'm now around 10.5% and I've gained about 14 pounds weight. (at least 2-3 pounds of that is water, 100%)
oldmusclemike
New member
Listen Micki unfortunately I can't really comment to your Question because I am not a diet guru.
In fact I really don't have much knowledge in the diet subject. I'm a skinny Ectomorph any can eat anything I want and not gain much fat. I didn't pay much attention to my diet back when I was training. Only for show preparation.
I know I could have built more and better muscle if I did. I could have been a better BB'er and competitor. My peak was about what you see in my avi picture. I did ok I guess but probably could have been bigger and a better look across the board.
3j and or some others can answer your Q's with more information.
Oh how I wish I learned and paid attention to my diet and ate clean.
Sorry, OMM
In fact I really don't have much knowledge in the diet subject. I'm a skinny Ectomorph any can eat anything I want and not gain much fat. I didn't pay much attention to my diet back when I was training. Only for show preparation.
I know I could have built more and better muscle if I did. I could have been a better BB'er and competitor. My peak was about what you see in my avi picture. I did ok I guess but probably could have been bigger and a better look across the board.
3j and or some others can answer your Q's with more information.
Oh how I wish I learned and paid attention to my diet and ate clean.
Sorry, OMM
oldmusclemike
New member
Yes ^^ how true and that's why I didn't become Mr Olympian.
Ah ha ha haa, lol
Gotta laugh ya know
OMM
IMT
IMT Rep
Find your will santaman. The better recipes that you can find using the foods in your diet the better your diet will be. Just your constant complaint about not liking brown rice and talking about it like its liver aint going to cut it with your diet.
Brown rice rules and there is no reason not to like it. The only way someone cannot like brown rice is if they have been cooking it wrong. rice is rice man.
Just like today when kids hate brocoli. its just because their mothers dont know how to cook it.
learn some yummy and tasty brown rice recipes and i guarantee you that youll grow to love it.
this is unless you where traumatized in your youth with your parents forcing you to eat brown rice.
Bon appetite santaman!
I'm gonna go with mike on this one, "and thats why I'll never become a BB competitor". Felt bit rude to say Mr olympia haha!
Well...there's the taste of brown rice...thats enough to not like it in my world lol...
RICE IS NOT RICE MAN...fuck me... My dad only dated asians for my entire youth lol... Motherfucker I know rice and I know rice...its not rice is rice... I'm getting mad just thinking about it lol...
Tell you what bro, lets meet up in mexico for spring break, fuck some way to young college babes and I'll teach you all I know about rice...and...if you honestly can say "rice is rice" after that... i'll eat brown rice forever...but...it will never happen. You're literally gonna hate brown rice after I'm done showing the world of rice to you bro
Santa! Thank you for your reply, you’re stating you did a test/Tbol cycle and you went from 16% to 10.5%? Or what exact compounds were you using?
May I ask how your diet was? I’m considering starting within the month after losing another 5 pounds.
I LOVE my veggies. I love broccoli and spinach, but the one thing I dislike is brown rice. I feel like it has a shitty texture and a different flavor. The fiber benefits aren’t as important to me. I like sticky white rice. Add a slight bit extra water to the white rice in the cooker. It will come out sticky. YUM YUM. I eat a shit ton of chicken and rice. I just use different condiments with it. I use those to spice up my Life. I’m more excited using different flavors nowadays than anything LOL.
OMM I see you’re from Florida, not south Florida by any chance?
Diet is key, I can stick to an extremely strict diet for extended periods of time which is awesome. I’ve been very lean before and very bulky. I just need to know if it’s possible with a strict diet I won’t fucking explode with sub-cutaneous fat and muscle underneath and make me look seriously bloated on a first cycle. Hence why I’m trying to get to that 10% bf mark. Just takes me a lot longer to lose fat...I don’t take compounds usually. I did Clen once and 2 weeks I doubled weight loss with it than I would without.
Just made my heart beat a little faster during sex and you can’t eat soup. The shakes are real.
This cycle i've ran:
Anavar (4 weeks start)
Test prop / 90mg ed
Tren acetate / 50mg ed
Masteron prop / 70 mg ed
HGH
My diet first 2 months was 2.4 calories, spread over 6 meals with carb cycling and lots of advanced shit I couldnt execute at all (I hired 3J for my diet needs...)
Then i asked for a more simple plan and got a consistent plan of 3k calories, spread over 4 meals that are the same every day. This one is very nice for me. Cant really go wrong or fail it unless you refuse to eat
The problem with white rice is the amount you're allowed to eat bro
In my diet plan, I begged 3J to include white rice... I get to eat a whooping 0.5 cups, twice per day, one of them has to be post workout lol...
With brown rice, I think it was 1 or 1.5 cups. So quite big difference in food volumes.
And brown rice IS better in all ways...I just cant stomach it and get it down. Its just horrible in all ways and shapes.
This cycle i've ran:
Anavar (4 weeks start)
Test prop / 90mg ed
Tren acetate / 50mg ed
Masteron prop / 70 mg ed
HGH
My diet first 2 months was 2.4 calories, spread over 6 meals with carb cycling and lots of advanced shit I couldnt execute at all (I hired 3J for my diet needs...)
Then i asked for a more simple plan and got a consistent plan of 3k calories, spread over 4 meals that are the same every day. This one is very nice for me. Cant really go wrong or fail it unless you refuse to eat
How much did that specific diet plan cost?
I carb cycle here and there. I can feel the difference when I have carbs in excess the day before a heavy lifting day.
I think my first cycle Will just include Test and Tbol. Honestly, it’s such a mild oral and I already have it on hand...
I would love to try tren one day.
oldmusclemike
New member
Ha, listen guy, I grew up on Bay Harbor Island on the very north tip of Miami Beach. This was 50's - 60's back when it was , by all rights a Paradise.
I was 1/2 mile to the beach if that and on the Intercoastal Water way. Biscayne Bay.
Off to College 70'. Back in 87' and opened a gym on Sample Road , Coral Springs. Coastal Fitness ....Corner of Margate and Sample Rd.
OMM
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It took you 17 years to finish college ? I mean that actually explains a lot...but damn...really bro ?
I hired 3J for 6 months, so it would cover prep, whole cycle, pct and maint phase.
The diets are tailored to you and where you're currently at.
The tbol wont go bad bro, you can still save it for your 2nd cycle and you really should, at least if you're thinking long term.
