My first steroid cycle plans - not entirely conventional

[DR. ATMOSPHERE]

I am 23 yrs old. 5'9'' 165 lbs. 9%. native american, lebanese, irish.

fast twitch. flexible
Run a 4.45 40 yd dash.
Bench 225.
squat 405.
High school all american baseball player few short years ago. (atv accident ended throwing career

Fast metabolism. Eat 4k per day.

motivated med student and Business owner. Life just opened up a glimpse of time daily to train.

I am going to see how gains come naturally. I would love to do AAS. The rapidity of gains is very appealing. Just wanted to give you guys an idea of my com********** My first cycle will take place when my natural gains slow. I will pay attention to the scale and my composition in making the decision to start. I also will not be wasting time with just AAS when I can achieve synergy with HGH and insulin to make the gains I desire.

Test Prop kickstart.
Test E 450 weekly
Hcg 250 2x weekly
aromasin 12.5 eod.
HGH 8iu eod off days.
Novalin R 10iu eod pre-workout protocol.


Variety of supps, herbs, and metformin on off days as well as clean diet to maintain my insulin sensitivity.

Train EOD heavy weight. 40 minute sessions. My body's stress response does not fair-well against longer strenuous sessions. light cardio on off days.

I will intake 4.5k while on this cycle for 20 weeks. I will consume more fats on off days. More carbs on workout days.

PCT will consist of a shot of GNRH followed by Toremifene/nolva/clomid protocol.

I fully expect to gain 12-15 lbs naturally and then 30-40 lbs on this cycle. Thanks for input. Should end up at 215 and after pct be at 205.

I will be on HGH all year with eod protocol and will use light insulin usage to hold on gains. As long as I eat spot on this should work phenomenally.

Already have raw materials freeze-dried. will be brewing.

 

[tury694]

Is your cycle going to be 20 weeks long? You should definitely gain a bit more weight before you start this. You should probably wait for some input from guys who have experience with hgh and slin, but I seriously doubt you need slin to hold on to gains. In all honesty you should train for a few years before using. I trained 7 years before taking anything. I don't think you are ready for this stuff. Insulin is not to be played with unless you know what you are doing. That shit is dangerous.

Put your raws in a cool, dark, dry place. Brewing for your first cycle can be tricky, but if you have done it before or helped others you can get away with it. All that being said you should wait a while before using AAS. No offense, but I call BS on that 40 time.

 

[DR. ATMOSPHERE]

i have been a type one diabetic since i was 10. blood sugar management is not hard at all. Just takes common sense for it to not be dangerous. why you call BS? ran 6.57 60 yd dash. Father holds various track records at GW university. Do I not look like a 4.45 runner? what are you basing that on? lol

 

[Roush]

What's your test prop dose gonna be? 100 mg eod for the first 6 weeks?

Skipping days with hgh is for saving $.. It has no benefit other then that. Otherwise inject every day.

If your metabolism is fast, and your a track fit style of athlete, you definitely may not be able to put on 15 lbs naturally.. Maybe over several years,, that's a lofty goal. (Been there tried that myself for years, with a high metabolism myself, over several years never put on weight... Did my first cycle at a weight of 150lbs,, got up to 187.. Would never of happened naturally).

 

[DR. ATMOSPHERE]

Also, yes it will be 20wk. If I am to do it, then I will go for it. My PCT should get me back where I need to be no issues. I stated up front that I will be using the scale and my composition as my guide. I do not wish to be natural. I will eventually get on gear. And I will do it when I feel I am reaching diminishing returns with the regiment I have started this week. I have lots of training experience. Just was forced to take some time off with getting the company where it needs to be and keeping up with my schooling. I am expecting to start on the gear as soon as the easy gains stop.

 

[oldmusclemike]

Also, yes it will be 20wk. If I am to do it, then I will go for it. My PCT should get me back where I need to be no issues. I stated up front that I will be using the scale and my composition as my guide. I do not wish to be natural. I will eventually get on gear. And I will do it when I feel I am reaching diminishing returns with the regiment I have started this week. I have lots of training experience. Just was forced to take some time off with getting the company where it needs to be and keeping up with my schooling. I am expecting to start on the gear as soon as the easy gains stop.

There is no such thing as easy gains, maybe I'm hung up on semantics. You are 23 and have a few more years to reach your top natty gains. You have a decent cycle proposed but cold be tweaked of course but you have a long time to do that.
You have a god handle on the lean siding of training and diet it seem, but remember training in the bodybuilding type of training requires a few principals of itself unlike SOME other sports.

Good luck, get your training and diet for this training and bulking in order. You need to gain much more LMM without the water (minimal) and you know the fat issue. you seem to be good in that department. 20 weeks is long for your first cycle.

 

[DR. ATMOSPHERE]

What's your test prop dose gonna be? 100 mg eod for the first 6 weeks?

Skipping days with hgh is for saving $.. It has no benefit other then that. Otherwise inject every day.

If your metabolism is fast, and your a track fit style of athlete, you definitely may not be able to put on 15 lbs naturally.. Maybe over several years,, that's a lofty goal. (Been there tried that myself for years, with a high metabolism myself, over several years never put on weight... Did my first cycle at a weight of 150lbs,, got up to 187.. Would never of happened naturally).

I will be kick starting just like you mentioned 100mg eod until i run out basically. I dont have a ton but enough to get me to the enathate. I think i will be able to put on a little, but you are right. juice is needed for some people to get big. i gain fast but the second i try to eat somewhat normal or if my workout schedule gets f'd up i lose it fast. I need to adjust my insulin to gain but make sure its clean eating. And add in that preworkout insulin protocol.

Thats interesting about the HGH. I know that it is common to pin everyday; however, i was digging into the rebound of coming off of HGH with everyday pinning and it seems to be not as healthy an option as eod. Most of the trials are conducted on children with GH deficiency, however, I felt what I was reading shed light onto HGH dosage. I feel that you should be able to go year round eod and lessen the issues when it is eventually time to give HGH a break. Maybe I am wrong. I will still look into this.

jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/87/8/3573

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jcem.endojournals.org/conten...g0828721003.gif

very interesting.

 

[DR. ATMOSPHERE]

There is no such thing as easy gains, maybe I'm hung up on semantics. You are 23 and have a few more years to reach your top natty gains. You have a decent cycle proposed but cold be tweaked of course but you have a long time to do that.
You have a god handle on the lean siding of training and diet it seem, but remember training in the bodybuilding type of training requires a few principals of itself unlike SOME other sports.

Good luck, get your training and diet for this training and bulking in order. You need to gain much more LMM without the water (minimal) and you know the fat issue. you seem to be good in that department. 20 weeks is long for your first cycle.

Thank you for your input. I will attempt to gain as much as I can natty. I know you know the juice is calling me! By "easy gains" I meant the low hanging fruit of gains that have always come quickly when I first start. I was up to (and plateaued at) 173 a year ago before I momentarily stopped my training. By "plateaued" I mean that I had not gained a pound in 3 months and was shoveling food. Just my age. With age I know I will unlock more ability to gain. I just will use AAS to raise that bar and maintain. I will do it safely. My dosages will never be extreme or very health hazardous do to having synergy between slin and HGH. I can gain weight with slin alone but I am not ever willing to compromise holding fat. I will update a few pics of my scrawny 165 later.

 

[tury694]

Also, yes it will be 20wk. If I am to do it, then I will go for it. My PCT should get me back where I need to be no issues. I stated up front that I will be using the scale and my composition as my guide. I do not wish to be natural. I will eventually get on gear. And I will do it when I feel I am reaching diminishing returns with the regiment I have started this week. I have lots of training experience. Just was forced to take some time off with getting the company where it needs to be and keeping up with my schooling. I am expecting to start on the gear as soon as the easy gains stop.

You just said you started a training regiment this week. You are totally jumping the gun on this dude. If you just started training this week then you don't need gear until you understand how to train and eat properly. Wow, you're not even one week in and you already bought gear. At least you did plenty of research but that could have waited and you should have put more effort into nutrition and exercise instead of buying steroids.

 

[DR. ATMOSPHERE]

You just said you started a training regiment this week. You are totally jumping the gun on this dude. If you just started training this week then you don't need gear until you understand how to train and eat properly. Wow, you're not even one week in and you already bought gear. At least you did plenty of research but that could have waited and you should have put more effort into nutrition and exercise instead of buying steroids.

Im pretty sure I have stated in this thread that I have lots of training prior. That I have taken a year off. I do not need someone telling me whether or not to juice. I am knowledgeable about drugs. I more was looking for anecdotal input from people who have had success doing different things and to get their opinion on the drug selection. I have received yours. Thank you. However, was looking more for input on my cycle. Not whether you think I should be cycling or not. I will be cycling successfully by the end of this followed by recovering completely. It is my choice. Just wanted input about how you felt about my stack. thats all

 

[tury694]

Im pretty sure I have stated in this thread that I have lots of training prior. That I have taken a year off. I do not need someone telling me whether or not to juice. I am knowledgeable about drugs. I more was looking for anecdotal input from people who have had success doing different things and to get their opinion on the drug selection. I have received yours. Thank you. However, was looking more for input on my cycle. Not whether you think I should be cycling or not. I will be cycling successfully by the end of this followed by recovering completely. It is my choice. Just wanted input about how you felt about my stack. thats all

Alright boss, but why post all your experience and stats if all you want input on is your stack? Just list the stack and nothing else then. I would have said that your stack looks solid, but you wanted to throw in extra information just for the hell of it, and get upset if people tell you you're not ready, which you're not. Correct me if my observation is wrong.

 

[PrinceDianabol]

Im pretty sure I have stated in this thread that I have lots of training prior. That I have taken a year off. I do not need someone telling me whether or not to juice. I am knowledgeable about drugs. I more was looking for anecdotal input from people who have had success doing different things and to get their opinion on the drug selection. I have received yours. Thank you. However, was looking more for input on my cycle. Not whether you think I should be cycling or not. I will be cycling successfully by the end of this followed by recovering completely. It is my choice. Just wanted input about how you felt about my stack. thats all

I have to agree with tury here; after a year off I would definitely not jump on any gear. You'd be best off training natty for another 6months at least to get your connective tissue strengthened up a bit. If your just going to be reckless and do it anyway, then I would suggest at least don't lift heavy. You can grow without lifting at all on test alone, let alone with slin + hgh... You don't need to "ego-lift" to get big on this cycle. Take it easy, don't push yourself too hard or you'll end up with another injury. Trust me, tendon issues fucking suck. And they can put an end to your cycle pretty quick.

Also your PCT - whats up with that? A shot of GnRH? I suppose you mean Triptorelin? I wouldn't use it... and I believe there are negative interactions between it and clomid, plus you run the risk of chemical castration if not dosed exactly... IMO the research and anecdotal evidence doesn't weigh up and it's not very effective, I would drop it and stick to clomid & nolva.

 

[DR. ATMOSPHERE]

Alright boss, but why post all your experience and stats if all you want input on is your stack? Just list the stack and nothing else then. I would have said that your stack looks solid, but you wanted to throw in extra information just for the hell of it, and get upset if people tell you you're not ready, which you're not. Correct me if my observation is wrong.

In fact, your observation is wrong. I post my experience and stats to acquire input from experienced members on things concerning expected gains and possible workout recommendations. Also, to give insight to the experienced people of this board about me as an athlete. After all, I have been on this forum for a very short time and would like people to know me. Also, once again, I did not place any sort of start date for my first cycle. In fact, I posted that I would be starting when I was ready after getting back in the swing of things and achieving gains to the point of plateau. Look at Roush, he was 150 starting his first cycle.

You just saw 23 yr old and have a programmed response to say stay away from gear. Let me tell you, there are a LOT of 23 yr olds responsibly using AAS and it is not any more unhealthy than an older person using AAS. It is just different.

Maybe you are on TREN or something

 

[DR. ATMOSPHERE]

I have to agree with tury here; after a year off I would definitely not jump on any gear. You'd be best off training natty for another 6months at least to get your connective tissue strengthened up a bit. If your just going to be reckless and do it anyway, then I would suggest at least don't lift heavy. You can grow without lifting at all on test alone, let alone with slin + hgh... You don't need to "ego-lift" to get big on this cycle. Take it easy, don't push yourself too hard or you'll end up with another injury. Trust me, tendon issues fucking suck. And they can put an end to your cycle pretty quick.

Also your PCT - whats up with that? A shot of GnRH? I suppose you mean Triptorelin? I wouldn't use it... and I believe there are negative interactions between it and clomid, plus you run the risk of chemical castration if not dosed exactly... IMO the research and anecdotal evidence doesn't weigh up and it's not very effective, I would drop it and stick to clomid & nolva.

I will be natty for some time prior to starting this cycle. Have you used Toremifene? I have a few folks close to me that are practically making me use it because they have loved their PCT since getting their hands on the drug. I was planning on pinning 75mcg of Trip. I will not be overdosing on Trip by any means. I appreciate your input. Once again, this is a planned cycle, I have stated numerous times that I will be natty until I plateau. That may be my previous plateau of 173 or for all i know it may be 180 or 200. I stated I will let the scale and my composition be the judge.

-thank you

 

[DR. ATMOSPHERE]

I have to agree with tury here; after a year off I would definitely not jump on any gear. You'd be best off training natty for another 6months at least to get your connective tissue strengthened up a bit. If your just going to be reckless and do it anyway, then I would suggest at least don't lift heavy. You can grow without lifting at all on test alone, let alone with slin + hgh... You don't need to "ego-lift" to get big on this cycle. Take it easy, don't push yourself too hard or you'll end up with another injury. Trust me, tendon issues fucking suck. And they can put an end to your cycle pretty quick.

Also your PCT - whats up with that? A shot of GnRH? I suppose you mean Triptorelin? I wouldn't use it... and I believe there are negative interactions between it and clomid, plus you run the risk of chemical castration if not dosed exactly... IMO the research and anecdotal evidence doesn't weigh up and it's not very effective, I would drop it and stick to clomid & nolva.

I value your input about lifting heavy and connective tissue. I will make sure I account for this. I have yet to have a tendon or ligament injury. This is maybe why I neglected to think about it.

 

[tury694]

In fact, your observation is wrong. I post my experience and stats to acquire input from experienced members on things concerning expected gains and possible workout recommendations. Also, to give insight to the experienced people of this board about me as an athlete. After all, I have been on this forum for a very short time and would like people to know me. Also, once again, I did not place any sort of start date for my first cycle. In fact, I posted that I would be starting when I was ready after getting back in the swing of things and achieving gains to the point of plateau. Look at Roush, he was 150 starting his first cycle.

You just saw 23 yr old and have a programmed response to say stay away from gear. Let me tell you, there are a LOT of 23 yr olds responsibly using AAS and it is not any more unhealthy than an older person using AAS. It is just different.

Maybe you are on TREN or something

Age is not the problem my friend. The fact that you are considering gear after one week of training is insane. Think about how that sounds. If someone is about the bodybuilding life then I couldn't care less at what age someone starts. That is not the problem bud. You seem knowledgeable on the subject, but you have no valid reason not to get back in the gym for at least nine months to a year before you start. You are just waiting for someone to validate your impatience for gains and it will not happen. Tell me a good reason that you cannot gain naturally after taking a full year off and only working out for one week so far. This thread is the ultimate example of using gear as a shortcut. The tren joke was funny the first 65 times I heard it.

 

[DR. ATMOSPHERE]

Age is not the problem my friend. The fact that you are considering gear after one week of training is insane. Think about how that sounds. If someone is about the bodybuilding life then I couldn't care less at what age someone starts. That is not the problem bud. You seem knowledgeable on the subject, but you have no valid reason not to get back in the gym for at least nine months to a year before you start. You are just waiting for someone to validate your impatience for gains and it will not happen. Tell me a good reason that you cannot gain naturally after taking a full year off and only working out for one week so far. This thread is the ultimate example of using gear as a shortcut. The tren joke was funny the first 65 times I heard it.

I think we have been talking past each other. I was fully expecting this cycle to start late in 2015. I am aware of the need to train and was planning on it. Classic case of talking past each other. Not sure what you read that made you think I was about to start. I have raw materials stowed away to be brewed. I have not even collected everything necessary for the cycle. I have no HGH and no ancillaries/PCT drugs. I had stated that I will be natty until I make the gains necessary to feel good jumping on the juice. And yes, juice is a shortcut. As long as it is done responsibly, it is a safe shortcut that alot of people on this forum are taking.

 

[PrinceDianabol]

I value your input about lifting heavy and connective tissue. I will make sure I account for this. I have yet to have a tendon or ligament injury. This is maybe why I neglected to think about it.

My bad, must've missed where you said you were just planning. Always good to plan ahead, I like your thinking in waiting for a plateau.. I never had any problems with tendons either, until my first cycle. Even in my second cycle I took it a bit easier, still got some inflammation. Just be very careful. You can lift light, just hit each muscle group 2x per week for a total of 40-60reps per week & eat at a surplus and you'll grow like crazy.

 

[DR. ATMOSPHERE]

My bad, must've missed where you said you were just planning. Always good to plan ahead, I like your thinking in waiting for a plateau.. I never had any problems with tendons either, until my first cycle. Even in my second cycle I took it a bit easier, still got some inflammation. Just be very careful. You can lift light, just hit each muscle group 2x per week for a total of 40-60reps per week & eat at a surplus and you'll grow like crazy.

Can't wait. thanks again Prince DBOL

 

[PrinceDianabol]

Can't wait. thanks again Prince DBOL

Anytime. I suggest doing some more research into triptorelin as well before considering it.