not suure where to post this

[rctriplefresh5]

so ive been training over 6 years...always had a hard time buildingmuscle, even with tracking cals at 4k a day, and eating good protein. Always had bad genetics(when i started lifting at 115 pounds and 5'8 aged 15 i couldnt even bench the 45 pound bar for 1 rep w/o a spotter..nor could i do a full rom pushup without putting knees on ground) took me 6 years to work up to a 290 bench, 445 dead,not sure of squat at 6'2 179ish and 20 years old. thing with me, is i never keep strength. right now id be lucky to deadlift 405...and my last bench workout i barely benched 225x5...not to mention my squat was like 275 atg and now it's around 205.
anyway....i got my total and free testosterone checked many times, and ive always felt that although they were in normal range, as a 21 year old ishould be higher.
my total tests from least recent to most were
270,450,535,477(this one's mayb a month old and the 535 is from last september)
with the 477 total test i got a free test reading which was 91 on a scale of 35-150..so again closer to the bottom half of the range.
the total was the typical range 240-1100 or so?
an anti aging doctor wanted to put me on test injections a year ago, but i didnt want to....he claimed that if iwanted to quit i could at any time with no effects...guy didnt care about eestrogen going up or that drug you are suppsoed to use to keep potence.

i jsut bought tbol last week and have been on it for 6 days,(not turnabol..im talking about thermolife tbol which is an herbal test booster)
i have noticed zero increase in well-being,boy comp,sleep etc.
weird thing is i have always had a good libido..can you have low test and high libido? thats prob cause i never get laid though.
anyway my question is this..i see people go on steroid cycles all the time, then come off, use a post cycle therapy (pct), and keep their natural production. if i go on Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) to get my levels to 900-1000(i think this doctor would want me in the high range) can't i do the same thing without suppressing my natural supply? im still technically staying in the normal range.

should thermolife tbol have kicked in within 6 days? even if nott he muscle increase, but better sleep?
and would you say my test levels, both total and free are low?

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

how old are you? 21?

 

[rctriplefresh5]

how old are you? 21?

yeah i figure the post was confusing. i hit those lifts when i was 20, but i am 21 now.

 

[nate212]

there is a lot of info in there, when was the 270 test done, was that years ago or recent. The numbers you posted for the lifts are respectable. Not going to win any powerlifting comps but they are not bad, especially given where you started from.

Why did you drop the weight in them, quit lifting? take some time off i missed that part.

I'm not a pro on testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) but from what i understand there is a risk of not being able to have children and of permanent suppression of the HPTA but not as significant as with cycle doses.

what are your goals at this point.

oh, most test boosters, if they work at all, will take a few weeks. Nothing dramatic would be expected.

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

I personally think your too young to consider Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) at this point. I think you need to focus on your diet, and supplementing vitamins and NO. seriously.

 

[nate212]

^^ i agree with that, as i said it seams your gains were very reasonable. Just have to stay consistent to keep them

 

[rctriplefresh5]

the 270 i think was in feb of 2009, i think. the 535 was september 23 of 2010, and the 477 was last month, as was the 91 free testosterone. my prolactin is always low which is good, and ithink last time i checked my estradiol was low also. I always have high cortisol though.
you aren't the only one who missed that part..i have missed it too. the reason, i finally gave in to trying tbol was because i am sick of having strong and weak phases(most weak). I was rpetty much stuck at 265 bench since december 2008, then from like jan2010 to june of 2010, i finally increased to 290..same with deads, they went from 420 to 445. 445 was cleaner and easier. bw went up from 160 which i was stalled at forever, to 179 for the dead and 176 for the bench. now my dead is down due to herniated disk(i dont have the best deadlift form..it's competition legal, but i still round the back very much).i still could prob get 405 any day of the week though..assuming my sciatica allows lol..and squat idk..i never thought i would ever squat less than 225 atg in my life even taking forever off....bench idk why it never goes up either..but i had a miserably bad workout of 225x5 the other day...when at my best i could bench 200x15, and 225 for 9 reps jsut falling short at lockout with rep 10.
i actually primarily train for strength, but would like to get myself to 198 as i feel it's a less embarrassing weight for someone 6'2. i will never be 220..not even a fat 220..so i think 198 would be ideal.
ok good..i was getting alil anxious at feeling ZERO effects from the tbol after 6 days....thought id sleep better..instead of having the usual insomnia at night and feeling lie crap during the day.

even disregarding the deadlift injury, i still never made solid gains on that either...i mostly go down in lifts and never gain. and in order to gain bodyweight, i have to drink a pack of ensure plus a day, in addition to 20 oz of pasta and still i stand at 6'2 176 today(a much weaker 176 with more injuries)

 

[Dreaded Pirate Roberts]

It's diet. Learn how to eat to grow. It really important the eat the right thing at the right time. Go to diet forum at get your diet worked out. The product your bought is not going to make you grow. You've got to do the work.

 

[rctriplefresh5]

4k cals should make anyone grow

 

[nate212]

^^^ most important above. do you take ritalin or adderall man? you write like a ferret on meth. that will keep you from gaining.

get your form right too. Shit man. thats also most important.

 

[rctriplefresh5]

^^^ most important above. do you take ritalin or adderall man? you write like a ferret on meth. that will keep you from gaining.

get your form right too. Shit man. thats also most important.

well the form is good but with max lifts for deads i use comp form as opposed to strict..sorry for the misunderstanding. and it's dark here, sorry for the typos lol. no i do not take nor use any drugs.

 

[UserAt204]

Sounds like you need some changes in diet as far as what to eat and when and the diet forum can definately help you out. Don't get so down on yourself, you have made some solid gains in weight and if you went from benching under 45lbs to 225 for reps, that is huge. I don't see why you say you continue to get weaker because you have made some drastic changes. Most people never put that much work in.

Besides your diet you need some self esteem bro. Your low self esteem is shinning through in your writing. Keep up the work and get the help you need then in a couple years you will be ready for AAS to get you a little past what you can on your own. Good luck.

 

[rctriplefresh5]

well i was at 240 for 6 reps bench in 2009, also my dead and squat have plummeted as well.
and i just feel 477 test is shit for a 21 year old as well as 91 free test...my dad who's 55 has 373 so not much lower than mine.

 

[UserAt204]

Well I would exhaust all options first at your age. If you are really concerned you can always see another doc and get another opinion but beware of docs that want to prescribe test and not worry about anything else.

I just don't get it though. You have made huge gains in strength and you have put on a lot of weight naturally. You can have fluctuations in training. Can depend on food, type of training and other factors. I mean you gained 64 lbs that's quite a lot. I know you are not satified completely but damn you have to be proud of what you accomplished or some of your story is not true. Post up some pics and not for my pleasure. Just like to see where you are at.

 

[rctriplefresh5]

well i \went from 5'8 to 6'2 lol...plus puberty. i mean a lot of people can reach a 290 bench much faster..sure im happy with my strength now..but im not happy i was benching 290 and deadlifting 445 last year, and cant do shit now. same diet back then.

 

[rctriplefresh5]

well actually that is a lie..i am not really happy with where iam at..i just dont want to come across as rude. it sucks when you get weaker than you were 2 years ago, despite not quitting training and busting your ass. if ididnt have a friend who was stuck for 6 years at a 400 bench with zero improvement that all of a sudden got up to 440, then went back down again(similar situation to me)..i would be even more depressed...but he';s much more experienced than me, and knows that big drops in strength can happen.
i just feel my test levels are a big part....477 is not a good level for someone my age, and i am always tired. i still dont understand why you guys can do cycles, and then use pct and be ok, but i cant go on Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) for a lil then use pct and be normal? im still not sure why.
i dont even know if i could bring myself to take Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) anyway...i never wanted to use drugs...although i never wanted a test level in the bottom half of the range of 20-100 yr olds

 

[3J]

It's diet. Learn how to eat to grow. It really important the eat the right thing at the right time. Go to diet forum at get your diet worked out. The product your bought is not going to make you grow. You've got to do the work.

^^^THIS!!!!!!

OP, i bet ya your diet is crap.. i bet ya u dont know what 4000 calories worth of food looks like...


but we can help!!! come into the diet section and ill put weight on that frame i promise!

 

[UserAt204]

Take 3J's advice. He is the man you want to talk to. Every person on this board respects 3J because the guy knows his shit and can help you make it happen. Try his advice first and I bet you will be more than satisfied.

 

[rctriplefresh5]

whether i have a bad diet or not,i still have low test levels. what about my question on why people can cycle and maintain their levels but people on Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) can't?
also why was i able to be much stronger a year ago on the same diet?
im not disagreeing with anyone that i could improve my diet,jsut saying

 

[ECKSRATED]

HRT people tend to have a hard time recovering because their levels are already very low hence the reason for being on replacement therapy. If u want to take a Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) dose for 14 weeks or so then yea you should recover fine. But when people hear Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) they think long term. Your better off just doing a full beginners cycle with proper post cycle therapy (pct). But your still to young man. Learn how to eat like a bodybuilder and stop worrying about your lifts so much. Worry about what you look like in the mirror. Stick to very heavy weight with reps of 4-6 on everything and your lifts will go up. And your diet is what heals your muscles making them stronger so u can lift more weight. Listen to what 3j has for you and you will transform on months. All about the food man. And stop being so hard on yourself you only live once.