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Recovery Discussion
- Thread starter Perfection Awaits
- Start date
rckpytn
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Perfection Awaits said:
even after you recover from your cycle you want to stay off and be clean for awhile. towards the end of your cycle the gains diminish and by going off your body adjusts to being natural. if you were to take 3 weeks off and go back on you will not get very good gains, trust me, i have done it. the longer the break the better the next cycle will be, provided your diet ad training is set. also i think for post cycle therapy (pct) nolvadex is not needed. now if your nips get sore or swell up then take some, but i dont think nolvadex works as well to restore test levels as other compounds. personally i would do this for PCT:
day 1 - 1000iu HCG
day 2 - 500iu
day4 - 500iu
day5 - 500iu
day7 - 500iu (by then your nuts will be restored and sex drive up)
day8 -whenever - tribulis 4g ED
tribulis is a very underrated compund, mainly because it is an OTC product, people think it is not as good as nolva or clomid. but in my experience tribulis gets the sex drive back up almost as good as Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) and much better than nolva/clomid. this is definately going to get some flames because it goes against the traditional 40mg nolva for 4 weeks then taper down to 20mg, but there really are very little, probably no studies done on males coming off a cycle trying to restore test levels. so keep an open mind when reading this and try it next cycle
bump
bodySculpter
I am banned!
What if you have gyno before cycle what would be the best compound to take, to make go away... thanxs jt
A-10
Delectable Injectables
rckpytn said:
I agree with the gains diminishing towards the end of the cycle if everything is left stagnant (ie, compound, dose, training, diet, etc...) as I've come to see most of my gains seem to taper around the 12 week mark on SE aas.
I dont know if I agree with the 3-5 weeks off statement where one will see very poor gains. If this is true then what is the purpose for many running testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) between cycles or using the blast + cruise method if each time their gains will become nonexistant very quickly?
Also why not not run Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) during cycle to prevent atrophy instead of trying to jump start them after the cycle has ended? Although the doses are low for the post cycle therapy (pct) u recommended I'd still rather not risk damaging my nads.
Tribulus is a good product but IMO nolvadex, clomid, or both is far superior.
"Studies conducted in the late 1970's at the University of Ghent in Belgium make clear the advantages of using Nolvadex instead of Clomid for increasing testosterone levels (1). Here, researchers looked the effects of Nolvadex and Clomid on the endocrine profiles of normal men, as well as those suffering from low sperm counts (oligospermia). For our purposes, the results of these drugs on hormonally normal men are obviously the most relevant.
What was found, just in the early parts of the study, was quite enlightening. Nolvadex, used for 10 days at a dosage of 20mg daily, increased serum testosterone levels to 142% of baseline, which was on par with the effect of 150mg of Clomid daily for the same duration (the testosterone increase was slightly, but not significantly, better for Clomid). We must remember though that this is the effect of three 50mg tablets of Clomid. With the price of both a 50mg Clomid and 20mg Nolvadex typically very similar, we are already seeing a cost vs. results discrepancy forming that strongly favors the Nolvadex side."
http://www.steroidology.com/forum/showthread.php?t=93855&highlight=nolvadex+restore+test
I see the reasoning behind the time off = time on + post cycle therapy (pct) and everyone including mods swear by it. Although its blasphemous to oppose the theory I've yet to read an article to support or prove that theory scientifically. Maybe there is and I havent seen it and I'm completely wrong np with me, if so I'd love for someone to post it.
IMO the time off = time on + post cycle therapy (pct) is a very generic rule created to encompass all Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) use. Its kinda like the rule about eating and then waiting 30 minutes to swim. Do all people abide by it? No. Do some break the rule and see absolutely no repercussions from it? Yes. Its one of those good rules to follow just in case. It'd be nice to hear from people that have had continous bloodwork done post cycle and see how long it actually took them to recover, whether long or shorter than that tme frame.
DocJ
New member
I believe time on = time off was created as a general guideline to ensure that everyone stays as healthy as they can while cycling. Plus it's simple and lord knows us meatheads need simple 
Also, it depends on what your goals are...time on = time off would be for a typical rec BB/PL who never wants to make it a career. Athletes who want to go pro, that's a whole 'nother ballgame (pun intended).
Also, it depends on what your goals are...time on = time off would be for a typical rec BB/PL who never wants to make it a career. Athletes who want to go pro, that's a whole 'nother ballgame (pun intended).
A-10
Delectable Injectables
DocJ said:I believe time on = time off was created as a general guideline to ensure that everyone stays as healthy as they can while cycling. Plus it's simple and lord knows us meatheads need simple
Also, it depends on what your goals are...time on = time off would be for a typical rec BB/PL who never wants to make it a career. Athletes who want to go pro, that's a whole 'nother ballgame (pun intended).
I agree, just wonder why its never been given more attention as far as medical research when its one of the more important aspects of Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) use.
Plus when did the time off = time on theory start to become mainstream? If long ago I find it suprising that its still applicable when information with Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) seems to change year to year.
bleachcola
New member
Keep in mind that time on = less than favorable lipid profiles. While time off = more favorable lipid profiles. Not aware of any studies that show an equalizing effect but I would assume that the more time you have off, the better for your overall health.
ManOfMuscle
Death Dealer
I thought a big part of taking time off was to keep the hpta trucking for a while so that it won't forget what to do next time you shut it down.
DocJ
New member
This aspect along with the lipid profile IMO are the main reasons. I heard an interesting theory about the HPTA proposed several months ago...the premise was that the HPTA reacts not only to the length of suppression from the Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) but also the frequency. In other words after you've done several cycles, even with at least time on = time off, your HPTA recognizes when you go on cycle again and shuts down faster. It's like it's saying; "hey, I've seen this before, fuck off I'm outa here you don't need me."LiftTillIDie said:
I
Insane_Man
Guest
DocJ said:
But couldn't this work just as well in the opposite situation? IE: Recovering faster bc it's familiar?
fr8tren
New member
DocJ....that is a very interesting theory...and makes perfect sense to me...
Insane..that too would make sense...
there has got to be a study somewhere...
back to the tribulus mentioned above , i tried tribulus...but i took the regular serving...where did the 4g come from? thats a lot of trib.
Insane..that too would make sense...
there has got to be a study somewhere...
back to the tribulus mentioned above , i tried tribulus...but i took the regular serving...where did the 4g come from? thats a lot of trib.
crushershockey
New member
DocJ said:Plus it's simple and lord knows us meatheads need simple
.
aaaaaahahahahahaha it's so true!! so very very true!
A-10
Delectable Injectables
DocJ said:
I'm not seeing how that would hold water. I'd think just the opposite, that after seeing the same thing over and over it'd tend to have a stronger resistance to being shutdown again. That would basically mean our bodies have no adaptation skills whatsoever. It'd be like taking an anti-e and your body doing away with est because it thinks you don't need it anymore, i don't think anyone has had that happen.
mustanged77
Tren Freak
bump docJ
I love when someone ask a question and an experienced mederator gives a staightforward answer and the other guy doesn't like it because its not the answer he wants to hear.
What difference does it make about all these hypthetical situations? If your not even getting your blood tested on a regular basis then all your hypothesis don't mean shit.
DocJ gave the correct answer. Most people on gear don't really know, so the rule of thumb for safety is to use the time on = time off theory. Experience has told us that this works.
I can justify anything if I've already made my mind up about it.
I love when someone ask a question and an experienced mederator gives a staightforward answer and the other guy doesn't like it because its not the answer he wants to hear.
What difference does it make about all these hypthetical situations? If your not even getting your blood tested on a regular basis then all your hypothesis don't mean shit.
DocJ gave the correct answer. Most people on gear don't really know, so the rule of thumb for safety is to use the time on = time off theory. Experience has told us that this works.
I can justify anything if I've already made my mind up about it.
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