The 5x5 routine

the only thing I do for obliques is heavy deads and squats, and you can see what thats done for me.
As for the chins, with the other stuff you are doing, its plenty, especially if you are taking them to failure
 
needsize i know im a pain in your ass with all these questions so i apologize. i tore my acl this weekend and im gonna have to have reconstructive surgery so i wont be able to put any pressure on my knee for awhile but theres no way im gonna stay out of the gym for 4 months. i cant do sguats deads or anything else that involves my knee. what would u advise doing now until i heal. what type of split should i do know and what exercises should i do since i cant do things where i stand up with a lot of weight like straight bar curls.

thanks a lot
 
honestly bro, I would ask you doc about that, you dont want to take any risks that could mess that up again after surgery
 
yeah thanks for the concern, i talked to him about it and he said be careful and stay off it, but that if i think i can be careful enough then lifting the rest of my body should be ok.
 
Well I would like to say that I just started the 5x5 myself last week.

Do you guys find that you ache for 3 days after you train that body part???
 
Can someone help me out with the routine? I can't view it because my account is not active with elite anymore. Thanks.
 
Ifrit said:
Can someone help me out with the routine? I can't view it because my account is not active with elite anymore. Thanks.
Click to expand...

I just copied and pasted a couple of needsize's posts (hopefully he doesn't mind):

Needsize's 5x5 revealed... (post #1)
I'll do my best to try and remember all the elements that make the program work.

The premise of the routine is progressive overload, meaning that every week you are putting increasing amounts of stress on the muscles, generally through small increases in the amount of weight used. The progressive overload forces the body to grow to adapt to the increasing amounts of stress, even though the body really isnt training to failure.

The routine consists of choosing a heavy compound exercise to use for each bodypart, these can include, squat, deadlifts, bench press, close grip bench, standing barbell curls, military press, etc. On top of the initial 5x5, you also choose 2 other exercises, and aim to do 2 sets on each, of 8-10 reps per set.
Here's a sample routine
Chest
Flat bench 5x5
incline dumbell press 2x8-10
incline flyes 2x8-10

The key for me when using this routine is to start light, at weights that you can easily nail your reps and concentrate on form. For example, say you can bench 225lbs for 8 reps, start with 195lbs on the bar. This should be easy, but if you keep your reps slow and in control, you will still get a good pump and have a good workout. Next week, bump up the weight by a SMALL increment, remember the key is to be able to keep adding weight, it's not a race to get to the massive poundages. If you add too quickly you will plateau in a hurry and the routine wont do jack for you. So you hit 5x5 on 195, next week its 200, the week after 205, etc. When you get to a point where you're starting to have trouble hitting your reps, add something extra to help, if you're natural, thats when I would throw in creatine and whatever else as this will help you keep adding weight. If you dont get all 5x5, then do not add more weight next week, stick with the same and the odds are you'll hit it next time you try.

This routine is very effective as it targets fast twitch muscle fibres(5x5) as well as slower twitch(8-10reps) all in the same workout. Generally when done correctly you can gain lots of size as well as some pretty incredible strength all at the same time. I'm only a bodybuilder and dont give a rat's ass about strength, but have hit lifts (ie, deadlift 550lbs for 5 reps) that would allow me to compete as a powerlifter.
*****
Follow up post:

Eventually no matter what you are doing or what you are on, the strength gains will come to an end. What I have found worked well for me was when I couldnt add more weight to the 5x5, I switched over to 5x3 instead, and was able to keep adding weight. The beauty there is that as you keep adding weight past where you were stuck on the 5x5, that weight you were stuck on will feel like a joke when you go back to it as you were just lifting more, albiet for less reps.
Here's an example I used when my squats went stale. I had been stuck on 405lbs for a while, but just couldnt get all my sets so that I could add more weight, so heres what I did.
week 1 410lbs 5x3reps
week 2 415lbs 5x3reps
week 3 420lbs 5x3 reps
week 4 425lbs 5x3 reps
week 5 430lbs 5x3reps
week 6 435lbs 5x3 reps
then back to 5x5
week 7 405lbs 5x5(now this felt really light after 435lbs)
week 8 410lbs 5x5
etc.......
But this time when I finally plateaued again, I was squatting 445lbs for 5's. Notice the weight increases were very small, percentage wise it was almost nothing, but see how it added up. When I first started the 5x5 routine back in the day, I was squatting 225lbs for 5x5, and since then the program has allowed me to put over 200lbs on my squat, and about 4" on my quads
i have a lot of old injuries, so I do a really thorough warmup, just enough to get the blood flowing as well as get the feel for the bigger weights, but not enough to fatigue anything.
Here's an example for bench
95lbs x 10 reps
135 x 8 reps
185lbs x 5 reps
225lbs x 5 reps
275x 2-3 reps(just getting the feel of the big stuff)
325lbs 5x5

****
Click to expand...
 
And some more by needsize:

Day 1 chest/calves
Chest- see earlier post
standing calve raises 5x15

day 2 back/shoulders
military press 5x5
side laterals 3-5x8-10
deads 5x5
chins 2x8-10
shrugs 2x8-10
rows 2x8-10
bent over laterals 2x8-10

day 3&4 rest

day 5 bis/tris
close grip bench 5x5
standing barbell curls 5x5
weighted dips 2x8-10
incline dumbell curls 2x8-10
skull crushers 2x8-10
preacher curls 2x8-10

day 6 legs
squats 5x5
leg press or hacks 2x8-10( I dont do any more exercises for quads as I dont need to)
stiff legged deads 2x8-10
leg curls 2x8-10
seated calve raises 5x15
abs - weighted static holds

day 7 rest
Click to expand...
 
i just gave it a try on a push/pull style 3 days a week program . heres what i did last evening at home rather than the gym . i have interchangable dumbells with shit collars and fixed 20's & 40's + barbell/bench when im here but anyways :
CHEST
incl. dumbell bench press: 92 1/2lbs --5x5
flat dumbell bench press: 82 1/2lbs --2x8
incl. dumbell flys :72 1/2lbs-- 1x5 -&- 62 1/2lbs --1x8
DELTS
dumbell delt press :62 1/2lbs-- 2x8
dumbell side laterals :40lbs --1x12
dumbell front laterals: 40lbs-- 1x8
dumbell rear laterals: 52 1/2lbs-- 1x15
TRIC
1 arm lying crossface dumbell ext. : 32 1/2lbs--2x6 -&- 20lbs 1x20

NEEDSIZE : next im trying it out on leg day . im not sure of what wieght to use on squats cause my 1 rep max is 495lbs but im thinking maybe 365 ?
ALSO should if you were me what changes to my chest/delt/tri example would you have made ?
 
chest/delts looks okay, I would drop the front laterals as with all the stress you put on them with the other exercises, they dont need any direct work. Plus, the stronger you make them, the more they do the work duing other exercises like bench.
For rest, on the 5x5 take what you need, 3-5 minutes if necessary, but on the higher rep stuff I would cut the rest down to 2 minutes or less.
For squat weight, thats a tough one, you'll know better than anyone else, you want to pick a weight that for the first couple weeks, you can easily hit all sets of 5x5 and keep adding weight
 
this sounds like a great work out program to follow...i think i am going to give it a whirl...thanks for the info
 
needsize said:
chest/delts looks okay, I would drop the front laterals as with all the stress you put on them with the other exercises, they dont need any direct work. Plus, the stronger you make them, the more they do the work duing other exercises like bench.
For rest, on the 5x5 take what you need, 3-5 minutes if necessary, but on the higher rep stuff I would cut the rest down to 2 minutes or less.
For squat weight, thats a tough one, you'll know better than anyone else, you want to pick a weight that for the first couple weeks, you can easily hit all sets of 5x5 and keep adding weight
Click to expand...
damn like a wieght that is easy to nail 5 sets of 5 for 1st week like 315 ? i used 365 but got 4 reps for 3 sets anb just felt tired/dragged out and realize i started this program when i was already over trained . anyways if use 315 just 2nd week add a 10 on each side and continue adding like this each week then im thinking since legs are so much stronger than chest ? thanks .
 
Hi. I'm new on this board and I would like you to critique
my routine that I created by reading needsize's stuff.
Before I post the routine, I want to say some things.
I kinda made the routine a lower/upper body routine
without direct arm work, because I think there is no need for direct arm work, since there are so many compound movements.
So, here is the routine and tell me what you think.

There is an A & B Workout, but workouts will be alternated.
So, it will be something like this:
Monday A
Wednesday B
Friday A
MOnday B
Wednesday A
Friday B etc.....

Workout A: Legs/Calves/Abs

5x5 Squats
2x8-10 Stiff-legged deadlifts SP* *supersetted
2x8-10 Front Squats
2x8-10 Leg Curls SP

1x 75 Standing or Donkey Calf raises (a la Nelson Montana)

3-5 x 5 Sit-ups
3-5 x 8-10 Decline Knee-ups SP


Workout B: Chest/Back

5x5 Low-incline Bench Press
5x5 Deadlift SP
2x8-10 Dips
2x8-10 Bent-over Rows SP
2x8-10 Flat bench-Flyes
2x8-10 Chin-ups SP


I'm looking forward to your replies!
 
I saw that article of Chad Waterbury in T-mag
(http://www.testosterone.net/nation_articles/244anti.jsp)
that influenced my decision of not doing direct arm work.
I will quote some stuff about what he said:
"The best increases in upper arm hypertrophy are achieved through compound exercises such as dips, chin-ups, bench presses and rows. Therefore, no direct arm work is prescribed in this program.

It's a strange phenomenon. Every trainee who's been around the iron game for more than a year knows that big arms are built from compound exercises, but people are still convinced they need direct arm work!"

And since this is my bulking phase, I think that it may not be necessary for arm isolation movements.
 
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