Captain Sum Ting Wong
New member
for the most part. but that IIFYM is used as an scapegoat for numerous fuckups that people tend to get into. OH SHIT I GAINED 4 LBS WTF? , yeah, keep eating them pizza slices lol
this whole Aesthetics thing is really getting out of control
- Thread starter Hull Tech
- Start date
for the most part. but that IIFYM is used as an scapegoat for numerous fuckups that people tend to get into. OH SHIT I GAINED 4 LBS WTF? , yeah, keep eating them pizza slices lol
That says nothing about the efficacy of the philosophy if someone doesn't fit it into their macros. Why blame the philosophy when the user wasn't even applying it correctly?
Hull Tech
Recon to Caveman
YOU prove how your 'fast food is awesome' diet is the better then me eating healthy foods. I KNOW that what I eat is good food and do most well adjusted people. I've written out what I mostly eat and what most normal people consider to be healthy food, I would so dearly love to hear your proof that your 'diet' is oh so much better then mine.
If anyone said what he said about similar US counterparts, your ass would be bent out of shape 8 ways from Sunday. In fact it already is for me daring to say if he doesn't like us, then don't show up.. You need therapy.
tiger woods ? seriously, your a tool. By that reasoning I can group your diet ethos in with zyzz and all his fans, so now your a zyzz lover.
If anyone said what he said about similar US counterparts, your ass would be bent out of shape 8 ways from Sunday. In fact it already is for me daring to say if he doesn't like us, then don't show up.. You need therapy.
tiger woods ? seriously, your a tool. By that reasoning I can group your diet ethos in with zyzz and all his fans, so now your a zyzz lover.
Yes yes bc I have advocated a "fast food" diet Hull. Point me to where I have ever said one MUST eat fast food, I will buy you a free cycle of your choice if you do. All I've ever said was when fit into a whole diet which meets nutritional needs, the inclusion of fast food will not negatively alter body composition but you have a hard time understanding that. You see it as black and white with no middle ground. What you eat is good food bc it fits into your diet not bc of what label you attach to it. I don't advocate a "diet" And therefor i dont need to show proof of anything besides showing your complete lack of objectivity. I tell people to calculate their caloric and macro needs and fill those needs with mostly whole and minimally processed foods and if they want to add in some foods typically thought of as "dirty" to do so within moderation and have It fit their needs. I'm still waiting for your explanation of how the body will covert macros from different sources differently. All you've said is personal opinions and no basis in fact.
My ass would most certainly not be bent out of shape if anyone makes a disparaging remark about the US. I view myself as a human above all and don't get into petty bullshit about race. I've made more than enough jokes at the US and every other country without making it seem like any single country is the best. Shit, if you have that much loyalty to Canada why are you not working for them and only a trainer? I you're so patriotic wouldn't you be happier serving your country even after the armed forces?
I mentioned tiger woods bc you said Nike funded your university to imply that "nike's funding" was indicative of having a great program or substance. Obviously Nike made a mistake with Tiger Woods (which was my point) just like they did with the school. My feelings are hurt now that you called me a zyzz lover, yes it's true.
So now can we please get back to how macros are processed differently from different sources? How about how kinesiology has ANYTHING to do with nutrition? Where you picked up your "nutritional guru certificate"? Or how about we just stop making ad homenims, red herrings, strawmen, appeals to extremes and any other logical fallacy you've made so far? Can we take your emotion out of this and debate it like civil men without hurting your feelings please?
DipKing
YAYYYY!!
I think the major issue with most fast foods is portion control. Many of these foods contain artificial sweeteners which stimulate appetite, and it is hard to just eat one slice of pizza. We've all heard the potato chip commercial "Bet you can't eat just one." Lets look at a slice of a Pizza Hut Chicken Supreme. I pulled this from FatSecret.com by the way.
12" Medium Chicken Supreme Hand-Tossed Style Pizza
Per 1 slice - Calories: 190kcal | Fat: 6.00g | Carbs: 24.00g | Protein: 11.00g
Really not as bad as I was expecting. Now, I do believe if an individual has his diet under control he can go out to eat like this every so often. I just had a long discussion with PinnHead about this same topic, and I've adopted his attitude about this subject. It takes far more stress to worry about not eating these things than it would to just eat it and have a good time when the occasion arrives. The problem for me arises with the quality of macros in the pizza. Yes carbs are carbs, I know what the Kreb's cycle is I'm a nursing student, but there's a huge difference with how carbs are processed by the body.
And I realize the video was catered toward a younger audience, but if someone over 40 trying to get in shape sees this and tries to apply it, I don't think they are going to get the results they're looking for.
12" Medium Chicken Supreme Hand-Tossed Style Pizza
Per 1 slice - Calories: 190kcal | Fat: 6.00g | Carbs: 24.00g | Protein: 11.00g
Really not as bad as I was expecting. Now, I do believe if an individual has his diet under control he can go out to eat like this every so often. I just had a long discussion with PinnHead about this same topic, and I've adopted his attitude about this subject. It takes far more stress to worry about not eating these things than it would to just eat it and have a good time when the occasion arrives. The problem for me arises with the quality of macros in the pizza. Yes carbs are carbs, I know what the Kreb's cycle is I'm a nursing student, but there's a huge difference with how carbs are processed by the body.
And I realize the video was catered toward a younger audience, but if someone over 40 trying to get in shape sees this and tries to apply it, I don't think they are going to get the results they're looking for.
And there is the gist of my argument, its not the fault of the food that people are fat, its the fact they cannot control portion sizes. That's one major factor at least. Becoming OCD about what you can and cannot eat while demonizing sources of macronutrients leads to an unhealthy relationship with food and quite possibly an eating disorder.
You still have to explain how carbs are handled differently. Everyone says it, but no one can provide scientific evidence besides "I know". Disregarding medical issues like diabetes, how does a carb get processed differently than any other carb?
Also for older individuals they're resting metabolic rate is lower due to age and other factors therefor they typically require less calories than they were younger. Portion control becomes more of an issue for them with a tighter caloric allowance for the day, its still not the problem of the food choice.
DipKing
YAYYYY!!
The speed the body breaks them down. All carbs ultimately end up in the same place, but something like sucrose will digest much faster. Not to say this is a negative thing. Simple sugars are a fast and effective source of energy. But, an individual who cannot exercise portion control will have such an abundance of glucose in their bloodstream a lot of the time the body won't have any need for it and save it for later. I also must add it the body will do the same thing for any source of abundant calories. But, these individuals eating an entire pizza are usually the same individuals who are not practicing adequate diet and lead sedimentary lifestyles. It is such a problem in the state of Arkansas in the US where I am from that 3 in 4 adults are obese and half of those have some form of diabetes, often times due to socioeconomic status.
Hull Tech
Recon to Caveman
Recon For Canadian Airbourne for years son, Tip of the spear.. what did you do?
And I STILL serve my country in training recruits and in service members. Police, fire and EMS personnel. I also work with PTSD victims and volunteer my time to help them in other ways outside of my normal pervue.. again, what do you do ?
And I STILL serve my country in training recruits and in service members. Police, fire and EMS personnel. I also work with PTSD victims and volunteer my time to help them in other ways outside of my normal pervue.. again, what do you do ?
Ok so now we're getting somewhere. I assume you're talking about glycemic index and insulin response basically right? Ok, you are right in one consideration but missing another big consideration. Yes when sucrose will be absorbed faster than a low GI carb BUT that is only in a fasted state or when invested by itself. If you know about the glycemic index of a food I assume you're also aware about the glycemic load of a meal? Protein and/or fat when added to a fast absorbing sugar slow down the rate of absorption and subsequent insulin response. The addition of protein and/or fat to a carbohydrate meal lowers the glycemic load of the meal and the entire glycemic load is more valuable than the glycemic index of the constituent foods.
As to your example of storing it later for excess glucose, if you mean stored as fat, that does just not happen in any realistic fashion. De novo lipogenesis needs EXTREME circumstances to occur and is very very rare in. Humans. Furthermore if we were to compare isocaloric diets, why would that be of any concern?
Obesity is a problem everywhere you're right brother, but that's the fault of the people not the food. We have become more sedentary and food has become plentiful, and many of us eat when we're bored/stressed/etc. so my issue is, it's not accurate nor fair to blame the food for making someone fat and thereby demonizing food (clean/dirty, good source bad source etc), blame the person that overate, didn't do exercise, drives to the end of the driveway to the bus stop, eats without measuring his intake, eats without knowing his caloric needs, etc.
I have never served if that's what you're getting after nor do I have any inclination of fighting another man's war either and I was never good at blindly following orders without questioning the reasoning behind it. Now in all those things you've done, which I'm not knocking (especially helping the PTSD victims, that is tough work), where is your nutritional background?
DipKing
YAYYYY!!
Very true indeed.
I would also argue that very very very few of us if any, eat a meal of just carbs. If we did, I'd agree with everything you said, it would definitely spike glucose levels and the whole 9 yards. I'd be willing to bet almost all of us though eat carbs with at least some protein or fat which will slow absorption times.
You've shown an open mind and if you really know the Krebs cycle or tricarboxylic acid cycle then you are seriously ahead of the curve. How is your program, I always thought I'd enjoy nursing more than being a doctor (minus the paycheck differences of course)?
Edit* I am not a doctor, I was speaking in hypotheticals.
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DipKing
YAYYYY!!
I am just starting in nursing school this fall. To be honest I'm somewhat intimidated. Being in the Nurse Candidate Program means I'm enlisted in the Navy, but I'm not an enlisted. Basically I'm still attending school regularly, but report a Saturday every few weeks for basic training. After I graduate, I will attend officer's school. I get some nice signing bonuses and monthly stipends while in school, the only catch is I have 3 years of active duty after I graduate. I hope I made the right decision. My reasoning for going military is to pay off student loans I have accumulated throughout my university career. That's very cool you are a doctor. What is your focus? I've heard stories from my peers dissecting a full cadaver is much less intimidating than just the severed arm haha.
3J
Super Moderator
i agree with this statement 100%.. but remember hull dre follows a clean diet too.. he just doesn't know it .. lol
realistically the IIFYM is a clean diet with a cheat daily.. if your eating fast food to hit your macros your not hitting your macros right anyways.. the protein to fat to carb ratio in fast food is ridiculous and absurd most of the time...
what dre is saying is that you can eat clean, hit your macros. and enjoy something with the 300-400 calories you have left over... is it OPTIMAL? absolutely not.. but it is a way to live and stay relatively healthy.. the issue is that people ABUSE the IIFYM system so badly that educated people in nutrition will not back it up.. i personally despise the idea of IIFYM as the public knows it..
realistically the IIFYM is a clean diet with a cheat daily.. if your eating fast food to hit your macros your not hitting your macros right anyways.. the protein to fat to carb ratio in fast food is ridiculous and absurd most of the time...
what dre is saying is that you can eat clean, hit your macros. and enjoy something with the 300-400 calories you have left over... is it OPTIMAL? absolutely not.. but it is a way to live and stay relatively healthy.. the issue is that people ABUSE the IIFYM system so badly that educated people in nutrition will not back it up.. i personally despise the idea of IIFYM as the public knows it..
I worded my response poorly, I am NOT a doctor, I was talking in hypotheticals. Nursing is more patient oriented and you're in a better position to help the majority of people which is my reasoning. Yes doctors have more schooling but nurses deal with patients more than the doctors do and are the first line. Again I'm not a doctor, though many pushed me to be one since I have a few doctors in the family. 2 of my cousins joined the military to pay for school so as long as you do good in school it will be worth it. I've dissected a few things but never a cadaver. It really wouldn't bother me though, I've seen worse first hand in the Middle East. After seeing bodies there a cadaver does little to intimidate me.
