trt and fertility

[Megatron28]

Just my 2 cents -

(PS - nice to meet all of you! Love these forums and just registered)

1. HCG CYCLING - you should definitely CYCLE HCG. One month on, one month off, etc.

2. RESISTANCE - I wouldn't go above 350, as your body can start to go haywire with too much HCG.

3. ESTROGEN - the HCG could be increasing testosterone.... which is quickly converting into estrogen. Are you taking an anti-estrogen, like anastrozole? If you aren't, that would likely explain your sperm issues.

4. SPERM TEST - definitely get a test. Many vitamins can help with bad sperm, but finding out what's going on with your 'guys' will help greatly.

5. KIDS - I use to be afraid of children and hate kids. Then my fiancee got unexpectedly pregnant. My boy is now 3 years old and thinks I'm the most incredible dude in the world. What the other poster said above - that hug you get when you come home, from your kid who absolutely loves you? Dude.... there's no better feeling.

Good luck!

Nice to meet you too. A few follow-ups for you:

1. Why cycle the hCG? Did you see the study in Post #18?

2. Can you elaborate on what you mean by "haywire"?

3. Why would high estrogen affect sperm counts when one is already on TRT?

 

[DINO-MITE]

CYCLE HCG - this comes down to medical philosophy, but I prescribe to the theory that not cycling HCG (going off and on) will permanently shut down your LH function. If you can keep your LH alive, that's always better. In turn, cycling HCG stimulates the LH, rather than fully shutting it off.

HAYWIRE - your body responds to HCG and testosterone the same way it responds to sugar, for example. Eating too much sugar will make you diabetic (again, for example). Similarly, everyone needs a certain amount of testosterone and HCG (once hitting a certain plateau in TRT) but if you can dose it out on the lower sides, with more frequent shots, you're giving your body the best chance of having minimal absorption without negative consequence.

ESTROGEN - too high estrogen will gut your fertility. It will not completely destroy it, but you're making it harder for the little guys to swim. The big part though is that, if you're injecting HCG and test, PLEASE be sure that you're also swallowing an estrogen blocker, or else much of that test is going to become estrogen.

I hope that helps!

 

[cybrsage]

If you need help getting her pregnant...

...don't call me, I am snipped.

Hey, SOMEONE had to bring it up!



But in all seriousness, having your sperm checked for count and motility is not a bad idea, it will help you decide your next move.

 

[Megatron28]

CYCLE HCG - this comes down to medical philosophy, but I prescribe to the theory that not cycling HCG (going off and on) will permanently shut down your LH function. If you can keep your LH alive, that's always better. In turn, cycling HCG stimulates the LH, rather than fully shutting it off.

HAYWIRE - your body responds to HCG and testosterone the same way it responds to sugar, for example. Eating too much sugar will make you diabetic (again, for example). Similarly, everyone needs a certain amount of testosterone and HCG (once hitting a certain plateau in TRT) but if you can dose it out on the lower sides, with more frequent shots, you're giving your body the best chance of having minimal absorption without negative consequence.

ESTROGEN - too high estrogen will gut your fertility. It will not completely destroy it, but you're making it harder for the little guys to swim. The big part though is that, if you're injecting HCG and test, PLEASE be sure that you're also swallowing an estrogen blocker, or else much of that test is going to become estrogen.

I hope that helps!

Why worry about hCG shutting down your HPTA (LH function as you put it)? Exogenous testosterone is already doing that perfectly fine on its own. Your LH is at 0 when taking exogenous testosterone.

Taking hCG while on exogenous test will at best have a minimal effect on your testosterone levels. "Resistance" will not occur as Leydeg Cell desensitization will not occur at the small doses recommended for guys on TRT. See the previously referenced study.

Exogenous Testosterone has already shut down your FSH. You don't need to be overly concerned about high estrogen when on TRT affecting fertility. There are many other problems caused by high estrogen that one should be worried about like ED, gyno, edema, acne, etc. though.

 

[Hypnotix]

Has anyone had a boy whilst on TRT, or using above methods to have children?

I've heard broscience passed around that it's higher likelihood for girls in the above cases.. I never pass off something as fact until I run quality control on it! What do you guys think?

 

[DINO-MITE]

Why worry about hCG shutting down your HPTA (LH function as you put it)? Exogenous testosterone is already doing that perfectly fine on its own. Your LH is at 0 when taking exogenous testosterone.

Taking hCG while on exogenous test will at best have a minimal effect on your testosterone levels. "Resistance" will not occur as Leydeg Cell desensitization will not occur at the small doses recommended for guys on TRT. See the previously referenced study.

Exogenous Testosterone has already shut down your FSH. You don't need to be overly concerned about high estrogen when on TRT affecting fertility. There are many other problems caused by high estrogen that one should be worried about like ED, gyno, edema, acne, etc. though.

Going to politely disagree on the fertility. The boys won't swim as well if your estrogen levels are higher than normal.

 

[Megatron28]

Going to politely disagree on the fertility. The boys won't swim as well if your estrogen levels are higher than normal.

You are thinking about a Natty person with a fully functioning HPTA. In this case, high estrogen would cause the pituitary to put out less LH and FSH which in turn would result in less sperm production. For someone on TRT, LH and FSH are already shut off by the exogenous testosterone.

 

[IMT staff]

Going to politely disagree on the fertility. The boys won't swim as well if your estrogen levels are higher than normal.

As Megatron pointed out your already shut down when on exogenous testosterone.....so it doesn't make much sense to worry about high estrogen affecting fertility. Besides studies show that if you run the proper amount of HCG you should remain fertile while on TRT.

Testosterone replacement therapy results in decreased serum gonadotropins and intratesticular testosterone, and impairs spermatogenesis, leading to azoospermia in 40% of patients. However, intratesticular testosterone can be maintained during testosterone replacement therapy with co-administration of low dose human chorionic gonadotropin, which may support continued spermatogenesis in patients on testosterone replacement therapy.
MATERIALS AND METHODS:
We retrospectively reviewed the records of hypogonadal men treated with testosterone replacement therapy and concomitant low dose human chorionic gonadotropin. Testosterone replacement consisted of daily topical gel or weekly intramuscular injection with intramuscular human chorionic gonadotropin (500 IU) every other day. Serum and free testosterone, estradiol, semen parameters and pregnancy rates were evaluated before and during therapy.
RESULTS:
A total of 26 men with a mean age of 35.9 years were included in the study. Mean followup was 6.2 months. Of the men 19 were treated with injectable testosterone and 7 were treated with transdermal gel. Mean serum hormone levels before vs during treatment were testosterone 207.2 vs 1,055.5 ng/dl (p <0.0001), free testosterone 8.1 vs 20.4 pg/ml (p = 0.02) and estradiol 2.2 vs 3.7 pg/ml (p = 0.11). Pretreatment semen parameters were volume 2.9 ml, density 35.2 million per ml, motility 49.0% and forward progression 2.3. No differences in semen parameters were observed during greater than 1 year of followup. No impact on semen parameters was observed as a function of testosterone formulation. No patient became azoospermic during concomitant testosterone replacement and human chorionic gonadotropin therapy. Nine of 26 men contributed to pregnancy with the partner during followup.
CONCLUSIONS:
Low dose human chorionic gonadotropin appears to maintain semen parameters in hypogonadal men on testosterone replacement therapy. Concurrent testosterone replacement and human chorionic gonadotropin use may preserve fertility in hypogonadal males who desire fertility preservation while on testosterone replacement therapy.

Concomitant intramuscular human chorionic gonadotropin preserves spermatogenesis in men undergoing testosterone replacement therapy. - PubMed - NCBI

 

[DINO-MITE]

Agreed on HCG keeping you fertile.

 

[juced_porkchop]

Has anyone had a boy whilst on TRT, or using above methods to have children?

I've heard broscience passed around that it's higher likelihood for girls in the above cases.. I never pass off something as fact until I run quality control on it! What do you guys think?

i know some that have had kids while on hrt and not taking anything to try to. as for more girls than boys I have no idea. i hope not id like a boy first lol

 

[Xwant]

i know some that have had kids while on hrt and not taking anything to try to. as for more girls than boys I have no idea. i hope not id like a boy first lol

You tell me I can have kids without hCG? How is that possible?

 

[IMT staff]

You tell me I can have kids without hCG? How is that possible?

For some reason when testosterone was studied on Asian men it was 98% effect, like a condom, at preventing fertility. I will add that when testosterone was discontinued all but 2 of them regained fertility out of 1,000. Which leads me to believe those are anomaly's.

In contrast when they did the same type of study in the 70's on caucasian men, it was only 72% effective at suppressing fertility. So it is definitely possible to get your girl pregnant on test.