Why is testosterone so difficult to get prescribed?

[300winmag]

Additionally, our "normal" levels don't seem to be a reliable measurement. Men today are less hairy, have more cases of gynecomastia etc.. than 40 years ago because testosterone levels are dropping with each generation and there are countless amounts of environmental estrogens that we're exposed to daily. Whether it's the estrogen pumped chickens to produce their breast growth so those raising them are more profitable, or the water we drink which is contaminated with all the birth control women take, or the produce we eat which is sprayed with pesticides, or the plastics we use every day- we can't escape it. There's actually a study out that shows how testosterone levels in American men has dropped 20 % in 20 years. The study ranged from something like 1980 -2000. Meaning a 60 yo man in 2000 has, on average, 20% less testosterone than a 60 yo man from 1980. And who's to say how long this has been going on? birth control was introduced in 1950, I believe, so has this decrease been going on for this long? If so, that would mean our "normal" range for testosterone is actually WAY off. Maybe our testosterone levels should actually be much higher, but the average level when the normal testosterone range was measured and created was already altered by this testosterone decline. Who's to say the average man 100 years ago, before all the environmental estrogen exposure didn't have 40 % higher testosterone than the average man today- but just because the average man today has this lowered level, doesn't mean it's actually normal. If we take the average of 95% or so of the population to determine the normal level, but 100 % of the population's testosterone has been decreasing since the introduction of environmental estrogens, that 95% considered normal, is actually lower than what it would be, say 100 years ago. So our "normal" levels are actually based on skewed results-chemically altered men. So who's to say that normal shouldn't be 40% (or even more) higher than the scale reads today. Certainly this would explain why so many men feel shitty toward the lower end or the normal range, but feel much better at the higher end. Maybe the higher end 800-11000 is what the average man had 100 years ago. and the results we see today are only the result of decline due to all the environmental estrogens we're exposed to every day over the past how-many-ever years.

Low testosterone in men today is probably real and I beleive it. The artifical hormones in livestock and crops may not help, could be a part of it I just dont know after freezing and cooking how much it actualy affects men, and plastics in cooking and such probably dont help. The big thing is mens overall fitness, look at the amount of men over weight and dont work out. Men 40 years ago had to chop wood, mow lawns with powerless mowers, pretty much had a to work a lot harder at life then we do now, besides eating and going to the shiter everything can be done from your couch. If men were to be in shape and fit I would suspect the numbers to be much higher.

 

[300winmag]

maybe its messing with other hormones in your body. Have you checked prolactin, thyroid yet? Iron defienceny, liver function, cortisol.

 

[NateDEEzy]

I can understand that- it makes sense.. I just believe there's more to it than being fit. I mean guys who work out consistently, who decide to to try steroids and don't do post cycle therapy (pct) certainly still are in shape, but report all the signs of low testosterone when their testosterone tanks and estrogen remains elevated. Additionally, although it is a combo deal (exercise and diet), the most important aspect of obtaining a certain body type is diet- you are what you eat. And it's hard to believe all the estrogens we consume and are exposed to, don't negatively effect us. Also, lifestyle didn't seem to change that much from 1980-2000 to produce a 20% testosterone decrease, sure it did change a bit, maybe, but that's a huge jump, there seems to be more to it.

 

[300winmag]

I can understand that- it makes sense.. I just believe there's more to it than being fit. I mean guys who work out consistently, who decide to to try steroids and don't do post cycle therapy (pct) certainly still are in shape, but report all the signs of low testosterone when their testosterone tanks and estrogen remains elevated. Additionally, although it is a combo deal (exercise and diet), the most important aspect of obtaining a certain body type is diet- you are what you eat. And it's hard to believe all the estrogens we consume and are exposed to, don't negatively effect us. Also, lifestyle didn't seem to change that much from 1980-2000 to produce a 20% testosterone decrease, sure it did change a bit, maybe, but that's a huge jump, there seems to be more to it.

Also one thing to think about is reality and realistic idea on your own body composotion not everybody is going to have 20inch guns and an 8 pack dont matter what they do, a lot of it is genectics as well. You take 10 guys make them eat the same food and work out the same, youll probably have 1-2 guys that look sloppy another 5-6 that are average, 1-2 that are skinny and another 1-2 that are built. So thats something to keep in mind.

But in todays world its like you said the food. I dont like I said am sold or not sold on the hormone thing yet but what I do beleive in is how bad processed food is, you would have a hard tim finding a product without corn syrup in your house or was processed. I rememeber as a kid in 80's we ate a meat, vege, and starch. nothing was ever premade or in a box, and I think that has a lot to do with it. Just general activitiy level, in the 80s TV and cable arent what they are now, no computers, ipods, etc. Even guys that eat right and work out go home and sit on the couch, vs in the 80s there wasnt anything to do inside people played outside worked on things, and were just active. Drive by any neighborhood these days and see how many guys you see outside or playing with their kids etc. To be honest with you its a lifestyle thing. I challenge you to look at your own schedule or others and find people who arent sitting watching the Tube or pc before 8pm daily.

 

[transcend2007]

Nate, to me this rant sounds much similar to the one that started your thread with. Why is it easier for woman to get birth control than it is for men to receive TRT. Now your pointing out testosterone levels over the past 100 years have been declining. Just out of curiosity what was life expectancy 100 years ago? I'll bet it was at least 20% less than today. But, that really does not matter either.

What matters is are you a talker (complainer) or a doer (someone who takes positive action) You have still not given us your diet, exercise routine, and body fat%. These are all things you directly control and you don't seem to want to discuss. Yes, I know its easier to talk about everything else. However, you should consider exactly what you could personally take control of in your life that would have the highest potential for making a positive difference. Well, everyone here will tell you diet and exercise are two very important ones. HRT/TRT at 26 should be your last option, not your first.

My last recommendation would be to not be lazy. Don't make excuses. Get off your arse and into the grocery store and the gym. You can buy organic these days with no hormones or pesticides. You also can begin changing your attitude by the very act of doing something to be proud of ie eating better and exercising. Perhaps will help you to start building some confidence and self esteem that you are clearly lacking today. Everyone starts at the beginning. YOUR PAST DOES NOT EQUAL YOUR FUTURE! You control your destiny. Don't waste it.

Additionally, our "normal" levels don't seem to be a reliable measurement. Men today are less hairy, have more cases of gynecomastia etc.. than 40 years ago because testosterone levels are dropping with each generation and there are countless amounts of environmental estrogens that we're exposed to daily. Whether it's the estrogen pumped chickens to produce their breast growth so those raising them are more profitable, or the water we drink which is contaminated with all the birth control women take, or the produce we eat which is sprayed with pesticides, or the plastics we use every day- we can't escape it. There's actually a study out that shows how testosterone levels in American men has dropped 20 % in 20 years. The study ranged from something like 1980 -2000. Meaning a 60 yo man in 2000 has, on average, 20% less testosterone than a 60 yo man from 1980. And who's to say how long this has been going on? birth control was introduced in 1950, I believe, so has this decrease been going on for this long? If so, that would mean our "normal" range for testosterone is actually WAY off. Maybe our testosterone levels should actually be much higher, but the average level when the normal testosterone range was measured and created was already altered by this testosterone decline. Who's to say the average man 100 years ago, before all the environmental estrogen exposure didn't have 40 % higher testosterone than the average man today- but just because the average man today has this lowered level, doesn't mean it's actually normal. If we take the average of 95% or so of the population to determine the normal level, but 100 % of the population's testosterone has been decreasing since the introduction of environmental estrogens, that 95% considered normal, is actually lower than what it would be, say 100 years ago. So our "normal" levels are actually based on skewed results-chemically altered men. So who's to say that normal shouldn't be 40% (or even more) higher than the scale reads today. Certainly this would explain why so many men feel shitty toward the lower end or the normal range, but feel much better at the higher end. Maybe the higher end 800-11000 is what the average man had 100 years ago. and the results we see today are only the result of decline due to all the environmental estrogens we're exposed to every day over the past how-many-ever years.

 

[300winmag]

Nate, to me this rant sounds much similar to the one that started your thread with. Why is it easier for woman to get birth control than it is for men to receive TRT. Now your pointing out testosterone levels over the past 100 years have been declining. Just out of curiosity what was life expectancy 100 years ago? I'll bet it was at least 20% less than today. But, that really does not matter either.

What matters is are you a talker (complainer) or a doer (someone who takes positive action) You have still not given us your diet, exercise routine, and body fat%. These are all things you directly control and you don't seem to want to discuss. Yes, I know its easier to talk about everything else. However, you should consider exactly what you could personally take control of in your life that would have the highest potential for making a positive difference. Well, everyone here will tell you diet and exercise are two very important ones. HRT/TRT at 26 should be your last option, not your first.

My last recommendation would be to not be lazy. Don't make excuses. Get off your arse and into the grocery store and the gym. You can buy organic these days with no hormones or pesticides. You also can begin changing your attitude by the very act of doing something to be proud of ie eating better and exercising. Perhaps will help you to start building some confidence and self esteem that you are clearly lacking today. Everyone starts at the beginning. YOUR PAST DOES NOT EQUAL YOUR FUTURE! You control your destiny. Don't waste it.

Very well said. I dont want to down play what the Op said because I dont think we know the whole story. But like said medication is not an answer to everything. I am 27 and on it and I would give a lot to not have to do TRT. Difference was is was a 173 and 210 half of what your numbers were. befored I was tested I was at 185-190lbs and it was a struggle im talking 1000 calorie diets 2 hour workouts, and just really living a miserable life, no morning wood for years, sex drive was apparent maybe once a week. Well finally I just decided that I couldnt keep up with it anymore because I was just exhausted. I had tried every diet, supplement, excercise, had thyroid checked and others things and nothing. So I went to eating normal working out for two years just to see what would happen. Well symptoms maybe got a little worse but not much but gained 30lbs. Finally this spring I had it again and decided to get re-evaluated. It was by chance that the nurse threw in Low testosterone and low and behold I had those low low numbers. But like I said and others said if I had those numbers and at that age I would really try everything else first, because I bet there is at least one thing you can change to help your numbers. But I also beleive whether its today or 100 years ago, not every guy naturally is going to have numbers in the 1000s and feel like superman.

 

[NateDEEzy]

Nate, to me this rant sounds much similar to the one that started your thread with. Why is it easier for woman to get birth control than it is for men to receive TRT. Now your pointing out testosterone levels over the past 100 years have been declining. Just out of curiosity what was life expectancy 100 years ago? I'll bet it was at least 20% less than today. But, that really does not matter either.

What matters is are you a talker (complainer) or a doer (someone who takes positive action) You have still not given us your diet, exercise routine, and body fat%. These are all things you directly control and you don't seem to want to discuss. Yes, I know its easier to talk about everything else. However, you should consider exactly what you could personally take control of in your life that would have the highest potential for making a positive difference. Well, everyone here will tell you diet and exercise are two very important ones. HRT/TRT at 26 should be your last option, not your first.

My last recommendation would be to not be lazy. Don't make excuses. Get off your arse and into the grocery store and the gym. You can buy organic these days with no hormones or pesticides. You also can begin changing your attitude by the very act of doing something to be proud of ie eating better and exercising. Perhaps will help you to start building some confidence and self esteem that you are clearly lacking today. Everyone starts at the beginning. YOUR PAST DOES NOT EQUAL YOUR FUTURE! You control your destiny. Don't waste it.

I understand where you're coming from. Truth is, couple years ago, I used to work out 4-5/wk and ate very healthy. I still eat quite healthy today, but I never have the energy to go to the gym anymore. Every time I do, I am either exhausted before even starting, or am exhausted very quickly-which shouldn't be the case for a 26 yo (I've had this going on for a couple years now also). Body fat, don't know. I've had everything else tested, including thyroid and everything was fine.
Additionally, your initial, i'll use your word, "rant", is completely irrelevant to what we're talking about, unless you are suggesting that higher testosterone is responsible for the lower life expectancy 100 years ago, which I don't think you are because you sound half-way intelligent.
You see, by not addressing any of the valid points I bring up, and instead decide to patronize me, you offer no valuable input here.

 

[ColoradoFlyer]

Ironically, I have the exact opposite problem. My Testosterone is in the 110's, and I can't find a doctor who doesn't want to prescribe me testosterone. I am trying to find out if I am primary or secondary, and still haven't found a doctor who can help me determine this.

Although I have low energy, some depression and anxiety, I have no problem growing facial hair or getting an erection. I think it is my diet (High-raw plant-based) that helps counter the low testosterone. I have more energy now then when I ate a standard American diet. But I can't build muscle or increase endurance or strength. Still trying to find a doctor who will try a round of HCG to determine the cause of my hypogonadism.

 

[transcend2007]

Nate, you missed my point. Perhaps you would have heard my point better had I used the word diversion. My point was that the 2 subjects you had brought up have not benefited your condition and will not.

Your comment about having enough energy to workout 4/5 times per week at 24 years old, but now at 26 your too exhausted prior to even starting exercising is a very serious statement. If this true, its VERY UNLIKELY low T is your problem. You either have an underlying other more serious physical condition or something happening psychologically that needs attention.

I can appreciate you coming here looking for others with similar symptoms. However, you should keep other medical options open and be opened minded about discovering more likely answers. Being too fatigued to workout even at a novice level may indicate something very serious. Or, if you simply have couch-potato syndrome perhaps consider stating small and building back up to where you were a few years ago.

I understand where you're coming from. Truth is, couple years ago, I used to work out 4-5/wk and ate very healthy. I still eat quite healthy today, but I never have the energy to go to the gym anymore. Every time I do, I am either exhausted before even starting, or am exhausted very quickly-which shouldn't be the case for a 26 yo (I've had this going on for a couple years now also). Body fat, don't know. I've had everything else tested, including thyroid and everything was fine.
Additionally, your initial, i'll use your word, "rant", is completely irrelevant to what we're talking about, unless you are suggesting that higher testosterone is responsible for the lower life expectancy 100 years ago, which I don't think you are because you sound half-way intelligent.
You see, by not addressing any of the valid points I bring up, and instead decide to patronize me, you offer no valuable input here.

 

[300winmag]

Another thing to consider and being 26 is not old by any means. but getting older does suck. Why do you think old in the NFL is 30 and in the NBA and Basenally 35 is old. At 26 your not going to rebound like you did when you were 18. When I was 17-18 I could go and go and go play football stay up all night, eat whole pizzas, even in my best shape I would be smoked doing that shit.

 

[Megatron28]

I thought males were generally considered at their peak physically at 25 years of age. To continue your analogy, not too many 18 year olds could play in the NFL (if permitted). You're right about 30 (at least for running backs), but at age 26 you should be close to your peak. Oddly though, don't male marathon runners typically peak in their 30's?

 

[NateDEEzy]

Could medication you take for your ADHD type sydrome maybe spur Low T? Really anybody that puts testim or injects even a normal guy is going to feel better, not guys with just low numbers will feel it.

Call me crazy but did u not write this in another thread:

I am young as well, 27. Started on the GEL and never felt anything, after a month felt like garbage, and overall T was 136 70 points less then when I started. Switched to injections 100mg every 6 days and feel better. Not great yet but better.

Why would you make this comment about the effect I experienced with testim, saying everyone would feel better, when u yourself didn't? Lol.. pretty contradicting my friend. Btw I really would like you to explain why u would do this...?

 

[300winmag]

I thought males were generally considered at their peak physically at 25 years of age. To continue your analogy, not too many 18 year olds could play in the NFL (if permitted). You're right about 30 (at least for running backs), but at age 26 you should be close to your peak. Oddly though, don't male marathon runners typically peak in their 30's?

Peak i beleive is actually a range of about 23-25. Either way point being your not going to feel as youthful closer to 30 then when you were closer to 20.

 

[300winmag]

Call me crazy but did u not write this in another thread:



Why would you make this comment about the effect I experienced with testim, saying everyone would feel better, when u yourself didn't? Lol.. pretty contradicting my friend. Btw I really would like you to explain why u would do this...?

I didnt use testim I used androgel. Either way most people normal or not normal will fell better on a testim like product, now many people like myself use it feel great for a while then drop off. Its like blood pressure meds, even if your normal the meds will still lower your blood pressure.

Why would I do what testosterone replacement therapy (TRT)? Well like I explained i was a 173 and 210 not in the 400-600 range if I was in your range I wouldnt be touching the stuff, But like others have said I dont think you have provided everything or have had everything explored by your doctor yet. I really think you are digging for something that isnt quite there, and really arent like the answers here which seem to be the same as the doctors.

Like said provide all symptoms in detail, all test done, complete stats as far as weight height etc. Right now it just seems as if its somebody that wants an extra boost vs what they really need. I wish you good luck.

 

[NateDEEzy]

I included height and weight in one of my posts. The purpose of my initial post wasn't to get help regarding my situation, it was to get opinions on a question I had. The purpose was to raise curiosity.

The point of my last post to you was to try and understand your comment that anyone, normal testosterone or not, would experience positive results from Testim. What is it about Testim that everyone, low T or not, would respond positively to, but people with Low T like yourself wouldn't respond to Androgel? What I wanna know is why you believe all people would experience noticeable results on Testim but not on Androgel?? Are you saying if you took Testim instead of Androgel you woulda had better results? If so, why, and why didn't you go on Testim then? And I guess everyone is different but on Drugs.com Androgel has quite a bit higher user rating than Testim. 7.7 vs 7.0. Meaning more people report better results from Androgel- which you said didn't help you. The point is, why would you say anyone would experience good results on Testim, but androgel seems to be a different story? A gel is a gel, they both do the same thing- they add testosterone to the body- if anything, based on user rating I used the inferior of the 2 products, yet I experienced results and you didn't on the superior product.

Based on this, your saying Androgel didn't help you only strengthens my case that I would benefit from exogenous T, as I felt great results even though my T is higher, yet you didn't experience the same type results.

The point is, when I tried Testim, I felt amazing, I had crazy energy, more motivation than ever before-I actually wanted to go out and do things as opposed to my normal state of simply being indifferent about things. All in all, I felt better and more alive than I have in, I don't even know how long. Vs. you not experiencing the same results despite being lower T than I.

I'm not trying to bash you, I just don't understand why you would say anyone would experience positive results on a Testim like product, yet this statement wouldn't be true for Androgel- they're both gels and do the same thing.

Additionally, your comment that "Its like blood pressure meds, even if your normal the meds will still lower your blood pressure." doesn't make sense- Androgel added testosterone to your body, so why didn't you experience the same results I did when I added testosterone to my body with Testim?

Your comments are confusing man

 

[SINO HGH]

I think you need not get prescriped, there are many ways to get testosterone.

 

[300winmag]

I included height and weight in one of my posts. The purpose of my initial post wasn't to get help regarding my situation, it was to get opinions on a question I had. The purpose was to raise curiosity.

The point of my last post to you was to try and understand your comment that anyone, normal testosterone or not, would experience positive results from Testim. What is it about Testim that everyone, low T or not, would respond positively to, but people with Low T like yourself wouldn't respond to Androgel? What I wanna know is why you believe all people would experience noticeable results on Testim but not on Androgel?? Are you saying if you took Testim instead of Androgel you woulda had better results? If so, why, and why didn't you go on Testim then? And I guess everyone is different but on Drugs.com Androgel has quite a bit higher user rating than Testim. 7.7 vs 7.0. Meaning more people report better results from Androgel- which you said didn't help you. The point is, why would you say anyone would experience good results on Testim, but androgel seems to be a different story? A gel is a gel, they both do the same thing- they add testosterone to the body- if anything, based on user rating I used the inferior of the 2 products, yet I experienced results and you didn't on the superior product.

Based on this, your saying Androgel didn't help you only strengthens my case that I would benefit from exogenous T, as I felt great results even though my T is higher, yet you didn't experience the same type results.

The point is, when I tried Testim, I felt amazing, I had crazy energy, more motivation than ever before-I actually wanted to go out and do things as opposed to my normal state of simply being indifferent about things. All in all, I felt better and more alive than I have in, I don't even know how long. Vs. you not experiencing the same results despite being lower T than I.

I'm not trying to bash you, I just don't understand why you would say anyone would experience positive results on a Testim like product, yet this statement wouldn't be true for Androgel- they're both gels and do the same thing.

Additionally, your comment that "Its like blood pressure meds, even if your normal the meds will still lower your blood pressure." doesn't make sense- Androgel added testosterone to your body, so why didn't you experience the same results I did when I added testosterone to my body with Testim?

Your comments are confusing man

OK to stop the confusion this is what I am saying. Most men normal or not normal will probably respond positively to a product like testim, now I am saying most I am one that will not. From what I gather a lot of people will respond positively for a few weeks to a month then will drop off. So overall what I am saying is that most men and again most will respond positively on this stuff even if its a short while. If men with normal T levels didnt respond positively to the stuff then why would they be cycling the stuff to get bulked up? granted the amount is more but still they had normal T levels.

As for my self and which you kind of have found out getting what you wanted and what you actually got is two different things. Doctors are going to perscribe you what they think is right specially with testosterone its not like some other standard meds where the doc says go to the medicine cabinet and pick what you want. And yes in theory Androgel was supposed to add T to my system but it didnt it actually made it worse, why I dont know.

From what I have seen its not as easy to just pick what you want and do this and do that, which I beleive was your initial complaint. Thats when we all kind of answered you that your T levels are not crazy low and docs arent going to just hand the stuff over. WHY? I dont know probably because the medical community has certain definitions and protocols, they may be right they might be wrong, thats just the way it is. Most of us here can probably not answer to this.

Ill be honest with you I have been a long time lurker here and this site is by far the best place to collect knowledge. But with that said I would take everything said on here as grain of salt. For one everybody is different, two people embellish and lie on the internet, three what some people are doing on here may be illegal or unhealthy.