Guys, good news!!! I got off 7 today!!! My girl and I did it like six times, and I did one myself. I might not be too badd off after all. That is in the ballpark region of which I was before. BTW, if you guys wanna give my sh*t bout starting gear too early, geta load of this. My first cycle was at 17, and I've done five cycles since then. That'll give ya somthin to talk about. It doesn't really phase me anymore, because I've gotten so much sh*t for it. mranak and behemoth, I have a lot respect for you guys. I have learned a lot from you both on the board. The truth is, however, that it is the choice of the individual to do gear. If one wants to take that path, he will do so. The best alternative is to read and become very educated. I am by no means an expert, but I do my homework, and for my age, I know a decent amount in relation to gear. Yes, I know that I may have grown another inch or two had I waited. My genetics for height are very disadvantaged. Both family lines are considered short. Anyways, you can't change the past, only learn from it. I hope that you do not continue to judge me based on my age at which I started gear. once again, I have a great deal of respect for you two, so thanks for the imput even if it was somewhat cinical.