My first serious recomp cycle

[calindan2013]

You are Mr. Extreme. Why not try it for 2-4 weeks and see if it works? You can use caffein pills instead of coffee. Dirt cheap. The gear you're running and the ketosis will keep you from going catabolic.

I am running MCT and I don't need any caffeine, in any form. It kills my head. I have a perfect diet. Why ruin my muscle mass and strength and perform like a 80 year old grandma in the gym and end up looking like a 20 poounds school girl? Thanks for the joke though. In such extreme conditions, not even the gear will prevent total catabolism. You realize we're talking about 1200-1500 kcal deficit which is 50-60% above the highest safe limit? I'm also not in ketosis from anything, my diet is not based on fats. Such a insane deficit and the lack of protein that is a direct consequence of it will wreak havoc with the metabolism and muscle mass, everything will get consumed. I wonder where do people get those funny ideas from.

 

[Dreaded Pirate Roberts]

You don't understand ketosis at all. The body performs in an elevated cognitive level in ketosis and performs at its highest physical levels. It does not eat the muscles for energy in Ketosis. The Drapa study I mention noted that athletes go into a state of Ketosis while engaged in competition. You don't have a perfect diet and don't understand the Bio science at play.

The point is to burn fat not muscles. Your at a loss for understand here. The Keytones force the body to burn fat not Glycogen for energy sparing the muscle mass.

 

[calindan2013]

You don't understand ketosis at all. The body performs in an elevated cognitive level in ketosis and performs at its highest physical levels. It does not eat the muscles for energy in Ketosis. The Drapa study I mention noted that athletes go into a state of Ketosis while engaged in competition. You don't have a perfect diet and don't understand the Bio science at play.

So what would your 500 kcal a day ketosis diet look like? Can you give me a example? Suppose I want to try it , just to see for myself, since I never tried it. Give me instructions if you wish, I will make this experiment and post the results here.

 

[Dreaded Pirate Roberts]

I will be happy to. I'm running out the door. Go educate yourself on Ketosis.

This is a roof protocol and should be noted it is extreme and must have accompanying amino acid supplements to avoid muscle cramps. ( l-argineen , potassium , Magnesium and BCaa) with standard multi vitamins. I will have you note I eat a raw organic diet with raw dairy. Raw = unprocessed , not pasteurized, pesticide free.

Ok breakfast one shot of MCT oil daily supplements and a 5 hr energy drink for appetite suppression. ( all fluids zero calories water if sweetened by Stevia in the raw )
Lunch 1 shot of MCT oil- and any fluids ( I drink about a gallon a day.)
3:00 snack 1 shot of MCT oil and possibly an other 5hr energy drink.
Dinner a regular home cooked meal high protein super low starch hight healthy fat. a salad with a balsamic vinegar dressing and avocado. A some form of cooked vegetables or fermented. I try to supplement 1 cup of some sort of yogurt or probiotic kefir a day to help balance the gut and the effectiveness of the bodies ability to effectively fight disease and to absorb nutrients.

Now this is a very extreme protocol and will need some calculations to keep it at 500 cals a day. The truth is I never bothered to count. I burn over 850 calories an hr playing coaching and training ice hockey. I'm not really worried about the count because I was happy with the results.


I'm not the garden variety Kid. I'm famous for the nutritional products I designed for some of the largest companies in the bodybuilding industry. I was at the top of the food chain 10 years ago. I'm also responsible for the world having access to more products than I care to mention. If you want to really get down and dirty go research the GAPs Diet and see if you start to figure out why it's the Ultimate foodie diet for those in the know for a strong happy health life.

you can continue to argue or you can't put the time into do the research. Results very for everyone. FYI on cycle the body doesn't go catabolic with out extreme extreme training. You not getting there working out with dumbbells at home.

Please understand everyone is not jumping your shit they are trying to help you.

 

[calindan2013]

I will be happy to. I'm running out the door. Go educate yourself on Ketosis.

This is a roof protocol and should be noted it is extreme and must have accompanying amino acid supplements to avoid muscle cramps. ( l-argineen , potassium , Magnesium and BCaa) with standard multi vitamins. I will have you note I eat a raw organic diet with raw dairy. Raw = unprocessed , not pasteurized, pesticide free.

Ok breakfast one shot of MCT oil daily supplements and a 5 hr energy drink for appetite suppression. ( all fluids zero calories water if sweetened by Stevia in the raw )
Lunch 1 shot of MCT oil- and any fluids ( I drink about a gallon a day.)
3:00 snack 1 shot of MCT oil and possibly an other 5hr energy drink.
Dinner a regular home cooked meal high protein super low starch hight healthy fat. a salad with a balsamic vinegar dressing and avocado. A some form of cooked vegetables or fermented. I try to supplement 1 cup of some sort of yogurt or probiotic kefir a day to help balance the gut and the effectiveness of the bodies ability to effectively fight disease and to absorb nutrients.

Now this is a very extreme protocol and will need some calculations to keep it at 500 cals a day. The truth is I never bothered to count. I burn over 850 calories an hr playing coaching and training ice hockey. I'm not really worried about the count because I was happy with the results.


I'm not the garden variety Kid. I'm famous for the nutritional products I designed for some of the largest companies in the bodybuilding industry. I was at the top of the food chain 10 years ago. I'm also responsible for the world having access to more products than I care to mention. If you want to really get down and dirty go research the GAPs Diet and see if you start to figure out why it's the Ultimate foodie diet for those in the know for a strong happy health life.

you can continue to argue or you can't put the time into do the research. Results very for everyone. FYI on cycle the body doesn't go catabolic with out extreme extreme training. You not getting there working out with dumbbells at home.

Please understand everyone is not jumping your shit they are trying to help you.

I'm working out at a gym doing pretty intense circuit training 4 times a week and cardio 4 times a week + quite some walking on foot. I am not training at home. I am going to try this, just for the sake of it. If it works, I'll give you kudos and positive reviews and my gratitude.

Here are my questions, please shed some more light:


1. Should I understand 1 tablespoon of MCT oil as the said shot of MCT oil?
2. What kind of energy drinks? Red Bull, any energizing drink, even with sugar and chemicals? I'm hypersensitive to coffeine.
3. Can the dinner be 150grams of turkey breast or rabbit liver with some mexican mixed vegetables or 150gr of basmati rice?
4. So my protein shakes will be worthless and out of question in this diet?
5. Are the energy drinks enough to keep hunger at bay? Note that they are also quite highly caloric, at least where I live, a full dose is around 400-500 kcal and full of sugars and sweeteners.
6. Are you 100% sure I won't lose muscle mass with this caloric deficit and low proteins while training at the gym and using Test/Cardarine/MCT? Will I basically be on a effective road to ripped?
7. Are the physical changes going to be good looking enough to warrant this kind of diet?
8. Is a margin of error still acceptable while getting good results? Suppose I exceed 500 kcal by 100-150 calories.
9. How much time should I follow this diet at least to see good results?

 

[Roush]

You don't understand ketosis at all. The body performs in an elevated cognitive level in ketosis and performs at its highest physical levels. It does not eat the muscles for energy in Ketosis.

the ketogenic diet is anti-catabloiic by nature , why , because its using fat as fuel, and in the body there is an abundance of fat so that it does not need to break down protein for energy (after you go from a glucose based system to a ketone based system ,, this takes adapting, at first the body still is starving for glucose for energy and it will break down proteins into glucose , gluconeogenis, but once it becomes fully fat adapted and in ketosis, it will run off of fat and ketones).


it should be noted though . any one who has ever starved and ultimately died from starvation has went into ketosis prior to death. So just because your running off of ketones instead of glucose, does not mean your not prone to negative health results, like death.

 

[Gainjin260]

I'm working out at a gym doing circuit training 4 times a week and cardio 4 times a week. I am not training at home. I am going to try this, just for the sake of it. If it works, I'll give you kudos and positive reviews and my gratitude.

Here are my questions, please shed some more light:


1. Should I understand 1 tablespoon of MCT oil as the said shot of MCT oil?
2. What kind of energy drinks? Red Bull, any energizing drink, even with sugar and chemicals?
3. Can the dinner be 150grams of turkey breast or rabbit liver with some mexican mixed vegetables or 150gr of basmati rice?
4. So my protein shakes will be worthless and out of question in this diet?
5. Are the energy drinks enough to keep hunger at bay? Note that they are also quite highly caloric, at least where I live, a full dose is around 400-500 kcal.
6. Are you 100% sure I won't lose muscle mass with this caloric deficit and low proteins while training at the gym and using Test/Cardarine/MCT?
7. Are the physical changes going to be good looking enough to warrant this kind of diet?

1. DPR will have to answer. Good question
2. No calorie/low calorie only (like 5 cal or less). No sugar whatsoever.
3. No rice. Stick with 100% rabbit liver- everyone knows rabbit liver is the key here.
4. No protein shakes. Get calories from fat. Research keto diet.
5. Buy caffein pills and take 200mg 3-4x/day. Increase dose as needed/tolerated. You say you don't take in caffein but All energy drinks contain caffein.
6. You may lose a tiny bit, but the test and keto should keep it to a minimum.

Going into ketosis for the first time. sucks. You'll feel terrible. Just tough it out. After 4-5 days you'll feel great. After your body learns to make that adjustment, going in subsequent times will happen without as much discomfort.

 

[calindan2013]

the ketogenic diet is anti-catabloiic by nature , why , because its using fat as fuel, and in the body there is an abundance of fat so that it does not need to break down protein for energy (after you go from a glucose based system to a ketone based system ,, this takes adapting, at first the body still is starving for glucose for energy and it will break down proteins into glucose , gluconeogenis, but once it becomes fully fat adapted and in ketosis, it will run off of fat and ketones).


it should be noted though . any one who has ever starved and ultimately died from starvation has went into ketosis prior to death. So just because your running off of ketones instead of glucose, does not mean your not prone to negative health results, like death.

Umm.. very encouraging.

 

[Gainjin260]

Umm.. very encouraging.

Don't worry. It's impossible to die if you eat rabbit liver daily. People that die of starvation only die because they have no access to rabbit liver.

Rabbit liver.

 

[calindan2013]

Also , how about this:

Ketones are acidic. A low level of ketones will not have much effect, but as the levels increase, the blood will become more acidic. The name for this is ketoacidosis.
The first signs of ketoacidosis are increased urination and thirst, while later symptoms include nausea and vomiting, which can lead to dehydration.
At very high ketone levels. ketoacidosis require emergency medical treatment. If left untreated it can be fatal.

 

[calindan2013]

Don't worry. It's impossible to die if you eat rabbit liver daily. People that die of starvation only die because they have no access to rabbit liver.

Rabbit liver.

Yea, good thought. Rabbits are lovely. By the way, there are NO low calorie or zero calorie energy drinks where I live. Everything is made to get you a fatso. so what to do? Drink cat piss?

 

[Gainjin260]

Yea, good thought. Rabbits are lovely. By the way, there are NO low calorie or zero calorie energy drinks where I live. Everything is made to get you a fatso. so what to do?

Caffein pills!

As for ketoacidosis- you'll be burning your ketones for energy, because you'll be active and working out. Low/no risk of this happening.

 

[appleton111]

Yea, good thought. Rabbits are lovely. By the way, there are NO low calorie or zero calorie energy drinks where I live. Everything is made to get you a fatso. so what to do? Drink cat piss?

I thought there were 7-11's everywhere these days.

 

[calindan2013]

Caffein pills!

As for ketoacidosis- you'll be burning your ketones for energy, because you'll be active and working out. Low/no risk of this happening.

Or just a small cup of good ol plain coffee if pills aren't easy to find, right? Those two are my only options.

 

[appleton111]

Or just a small cup of good ol plain coffee if pills aren't easy to find, right? Those two are my only options.

just buy some coffee and brew it brother, your drowning in a glass of water.

 

[Gainjin260]

Or just a small cup of good ol plain coffee if pills aren't easy to find, right? Those two are my only options.

You said you didn't drink coffee. Either way is fine.

 

[calindan2013]

Well, since I'll start this tommorrow, I guess I'll erase my two Big Macs from today in 2 days of ketogenic diet/starvation/MCTization, so no damage done today.

 

[appleton111]

Well, since I'll start this tommorrow, I guess I'll erase my two Big Macs from today in 2 days of ketogenic diet/starvation/MCTization, so no damage done today.

Whens the last time you had your thyroid checked? you mentioned that your sensitive to coffee or is your metabolism always high?

 

[calindan2013]

Whens the last time you had your thyroid checked? you mentioned that your sensitive to coffee or is your metabolism always high?

I am sensitive to coffee since forever, I was a endomorph since forever and prone to being fat, thiroid check in my previous life if i recall correctly.

 

[appleton111]

I am sensitive to coffee since forever, I was a endomorph since forever and prone to being fat, thiroid check in my previous life if i recall correctly.

Previous life? What where you a monk before?