bigmitch69
Squat/Bench/Deadlift
Does anyone take Proviron? If so, does it help with gyno, water retention or acne? Or do you take it for another reason?
Or do you just think it has no use?
Or do you just think it has no use?
Proviron. Does it have a use??
- Thread starter bigmitch69
- Start date
C
capospo
Guest
Proviron is a synthetic, orally effective androgen which does not have any anabolic characteristics. Proviron is used in school medicine to ease or cure disturbances eaused by a deficiency of male sex hormones. Many athletes, for this reason, often use Proviron as an Estrogen antagonist. It is completely compatible with all other steroids. Also, many athletes often use Proviron at the end of a steroid cycle in order to increase the reduced testosterone production. This, however is not a good idea because Proviron has no effect on the body's own testosterone production but as mentioned in the beginning, only reduces or completely eliminates the dysfunctions caused by the testosterone deficiency.
Proviron is therefore taken during a steroid cycle or after discontinuing the use of the steroids, to eliminate a possible impotency or a reduced sexual interest. This, however does not contribute to the maintainance of strength and muscle mass after the treatment. There are other better suited compounds for this (see Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) and Clomid). For this reason Proviron is unfortunately considered by many to be a useless and unnecessary compound, however you should be aware that Proviron is an estrogen antagonist which means it will prevent the aromatization of steroids. Unlike the anti-estrogen Nolvadex which only blocks the estrogen receptors, Proviron already prevents the aromatizing of steroids. Therefore gynecomastia and increased water retention are successfully blocked.
In the past it was common for bodybuilders to take a daily dose of one 25 mg tablet over several weeks, sometimes even months, in order to appear hard all year round. This was especially important for athletes appearances at guest performances, seminars and photo sessions. Today Clenbuterol is usually taken over the entire year since possible virilization symptoms cannot occur which is not yet the case with Proviron. Since Proviron is very effective male athletes usually need only 50 mg/day. In some cases 25 mg per day is sufficient. When combining Proviron with Nolvadex (50 mg Proviron/day and 20 mg Nolvadex/day) this will lead to an almost complete suppression of estrogen.
Proviron is therefore taken during a steroid cycle or after discontinuing the use of the steroids, to eliminate a possible impotency or a reduced sexual interest. This, however does not contribute to the maintainance of strength and muscle mass after the treatment. There are other better suited compounds for this (see Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) and Clomid). For this reason Proviron is unfortunately considered by many to be a useless and unnecessary compound, however you should be aware that Proviron is an estrogen antagonist which means it will prevent the aromatization of steroids. Unlike the anti-estrogen Nolvadex which only blocks the estrogen receptors, Proviron already prevents the aromatizing of steroids. Therefore gynecomastia and increased water retention are successfully blocked.
In the past it was common for bodybuilders to take a daily dose of one 25 mg tablet over several weeks, sometimes even months, in order to appear hard all year round. This was especially important for athletes appearances at guest performances, seminars and photo sessions. Today Clenbuterol is usually taken over the entire year since possible virilization symptoms cannot occur which is not yet the case with Proviron. Since Proviron is very effective male athletes usually need only 50 mg/day. In some cases 25 mg per day is sufficient. When combining Proviron with Nolvadex (50 mg Proviron/day and 20 mg Nolvadex/day) this will lead to an almost complete suppression of estrogen.
C
capospo
Guest
Also, it is one of the weaker AI's but will help with water retention.
bigmitch69
Squat/Bench/Deadlift
So its helps increase sperm production and libido buts thats about it?
Doesn't help with gyno or acne?
Anybody else use it? I can get it for pennies so the cost isn't the problem but i don't want to be taken anything that my body really doesn't need. If that makes sense?
If it has no other benefits i won't include it in next cycle.
Doesn't help with gyno or acne?
Anybody else use it? I can get it for pennies so the cost isn't the problem but i don't want to be taken anything that my body really doesn't need. If that makes sense?
If it has no other benefits i won't include it in next cycle.
C
capospo
Guest
Sorry Trev but that's your opinion. I'm using and works for me. Maybe at higher doses and bigger stacks Proviron might not be as effective at water retention as some of the other AI's. For everyone one person who doesn't like Proviron I know one who does and says it works. The only way to find out is try it and see.
StoneColdNTO
Administrator
capospo said:
Bro.....Proviron does very little if anthing to combat water retention/bloat....period.
capospo said:
Its a bit more than my opinion. You haven't done your homework.
You should be sorry, Mr. Newbie Sir, because you're out of line. You're speculating and re-reciting other speculation as passing it off as fact. If it really worked, there would be empirical evidence proving it (based on controlled studies), just like there is emperical evidence that arimidex, aromasin, nolvadex, letrozole, etc. work.
You or anyone else saying it works doesn't necessarily mean that it does. If I say that a dogs tail is a leg does that mean he has 5 legs? Of course not, me saying a tail is a leg doesn't make it so. You calling proviron an anti estrogen doesn't make it one.
Look, the placebo effect can be very powerful. In the end, do you really care if something really works if you think it works? Maybe not. Maybe that's a classic distinction without a difference. What I'm saying is, if you believe it works for you, maybe you aren't wasting your money on it, because you get the happiness that you wanted out of it. However, if I snuck into your house and substituted sugar pills for your proviron and you kept taking them, thinking they were proviron, would you bet your life that you wouldn't still be saying "I'm using it and it works for me?"
Please don't go around dispensing advice to other newbies that is based on speculation and false myths and disguising it as fact. That could be dangerous. The other newbie could end up with gynomastia and all you could do was say "I dunno man, it works for me, sorry for advising you to use yourself as an experiment, I hope you enjoy your new boobs bro.
" I'm not saying do not use proviron. I use it myself and I like what it does. I'll even admit to perceiving a slightly harder appearance in the mirror. I'm saying, very emphatically, do not rely on proviron as your only means of dealing with estrogen, especially if you don't have a lot of experience.
bigmitch69
Squat/Bench/Deadlift
Thank you for all the responses. I have decided to include proviron in my next cycle but not as an Aromatase inhibitor (AI). As it only costs a few pennies, i'll give it a go and see if it increases my libido or gives me a harder look. I'll keep the nolva on hand for the itchy nips.
Thanks guys.
Thanks guys.
C
capospo
Guest
Interesting Trev and I'm not getting into a pissing match with you but not everything works the same for everyone so does that mean that nobody should give their opinion? Because I'm new doesn't mean I can't research and get valid information. There are several people that claim it works and so you are saying they are lying? Why would mods post stuff and lie about it? It don't make sense to me. Please enlighten me because you got mods posting stuff right here in ology about Proviron and it working and guys who say it don't work are simply misinformed. If you say one thing and another mod says something else (and this is quite common) then who is lying? According to you there is only one right answer, or at least that is how you are making it sound. See thread: http://www.steroidology.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10 If I can't trust what I read from supposedly people who are veterans here then please explain the purpose of this board. I thought we were all here to give opinions and learn from people who know. You are blasting me for taking information that is posted by guys here that are veterans and because you disagree you call me newbie and whatever else. How about just stick to posting your opinion bro. Unless you got scientific data to dispute what the other guys are saying, your opinion holds as much weight as the others.
C
capospo
Guest
Trev, also I'd like to note that I wouldn't tell anyone to simply use that and rely on it. I'm a firm believer in that not everything works the same for everyone. I prefer to have Nolva on hand regardless of the Aromatase inhibitor (AI) I'm using. If some guy is gonna wait until he has a new set of boobs before he does anything about it, that's his own fault and not anyone elses. A lot of newbies are ignorant and you can't blame anyone but them for that. I made certain that I had a relatively good understanding of what could happen and what to do about it before I started sticking myself. Everywhere I read, Proviron is an Aromatase inhibitor (AI). I've been using and to be honest if I notice that it's not working, then I'll use Nolva until I get a hold of Aromasin. I guess my point is you don't know if it doesn't work for you unless you try it and see. Unless I've got data that would suggest Proviron can't be used that way, I have no reason to believe it won't work unless I experience it not working for me firsthand. Peace bro and no hard feelings as I'm trying to learn as much as I can here and I think sometimes some of the people around here get big heads and think that they are the only one with authority to give advice. I haven't used Aromasin yet or Arimidex either but does that mean I don't know what it's used for and if someone asks and I can't intelligently answer them? Maybe when you get into specific dosages, yeah but then I would not give dosages for someone to try unless I've done it myself and had experience with it. Have a great day!
Capo, it sounds to me like you're going to believe what you want to believe no matter what I might tell you. Fine, I tried.
I would love to post up a bunch of studies but its hard to prove a negative. I'm virtually certain that Proviron has never been used in a study to treat or prevent gyno. To call it an anti estrogen and to say it "works" (because the bodybuiliding legend says so) is dangerous at best.
Sorry but I do get a little hot when somebody who has done 1% of the reading I have gives dangerous advice passing it off like its based on fact, myself and SC have to correct them, and then they turn around and tell us its just our opinion. You're right I should try to be more patient but sometimes it is frustrating trying to help people out and they want to fight me.
I think that if you're going to claim that proviron is an antiestogen, the burden is on you to prove that it is. You can't prove it because there is no evidence. I submit that the lack of evidence indicates strongly that proviron is not an anti estrogen. Think about it. I'm sure we can agree that schering would take millions of dollars if it could prove that proviron is an anti estrogen. The haven't done so.
I would love to post up a bunch of studies but its hard to prove a negative. I'm virtually certain that Proviron has never been used in a study to treat or prevent gyno. To call it an anti estrogen and to say it "works" (because the bodybuiliding legend says so) is dangerous at best.
Sorry but I do get a little hot when somebody who has done 1% of the reading I have gives dangerous advice passing it off like its based on fact, myself and SC have to correct them, and then they turn around and tell us its just our opinion. You're right I should try to be more patient but sometimes it is frustrating trying to help people out and they want to fight me.
I think that if you're going to claim that proviron is an antiestogen, the burden is on you to prove that it is. You can't prove it because there is no evidence. I submit that the lack of evidence indicates strongly that proviron is not an anti estrogen. Think about it. I'm sure we can agree that schering would take millions of dollars if it could prove that proviron is an anti estrogen. The haven't done so.
C
capospo
Guest
Trevdog said:
Trev, again no hard feelings but I do have a question. Why is it that I see you only try to make me look bad or like I don't know what I'm talking about? I've noticed and correct me if I'm wrong but when another MOD or someone who has been on here for a while says something about Proviron working, you don't say anything to them but the minute I say something, I'm a dumb newbie who can't read who will believe whatever. I mean, come on bro. I don't get it. These guys are reciting the same stuff I'm posting or saying but when I say it, it's BS and when they say it, you don't comment or address it. Let's stay consistant. How is anyone to know what's BS and what is factual if some of you giving advice pick and choose when you want to dissect someone's post simply because they are new and leave someone alone because they've been around longer, even though you disagree. I'm taking information that veterans of this board are saying and applying that. Am I wrong for that? I'm not the only one who asks questions around here. Depending on what day of the week it is, you may get 10 different answers and all from veterans. Basically it further supports the fact that on some issues there is no right or wrong answer and you may have to try for yourself and find out. I really don't understand how two people who are MODs or veterans can have two completely different opinions about something and both swear their opinion to be true rather than just say IMO. Someone is full of it and if that's so, then they should be called out on it. The new people who are coming here for the answers should not be put down because they got bad advice from someone "who is supposed to know better" and therefore recycled that advice. I guess to sum it up, who can you trust you are getting the correct answer from then? I know I can't be the only confused person around here when it comes to asking certain questions and the type of responses you get.
MotownMuscle
New member
I only use it pre contest. Its good for making my lower dose Prop work better and it makes me harder. Also great for you Libido.
rocko419
Hello ???
capo your a bit sensative buddy. I will agree that sometimes there lacks
Consistency some times around hear. Also I don’t know bro it did seam like you just cut and past some profile that some one had somewhere which isen’t really an opinion and not a first hand one which is what I look for not just some quote. And I got to give ya some kinda respect even though I would never go up against 2 mod’s on any subject. If 2 of them are saying the same think like SC and Trev are then I wouldn’t even risk being wrong by saying 1 thing going against what the 2 mod’s had just stated. Just me though. I have to agree and not that I have 1 ounce of first hand knowledge cuzz even though I have provin on hand I never used it yet But But
I have read multable things supporting what SC and Trev said. Sorry bud. And I don’t really see guys picking on you I think your feeling a bit to much estrogen maybe, Lol But again there does seam to be a bit of inconsistencies. Now SC sending me packing for 3 days I thought was not consistent with some other things I may have thought were grounds for action like action was brought against me.. But that’s ok. I once got pulled over by 50 for speeding and I was obviously pissed and I said to the cop “ I wasen’t the only one speeding why me?” And his response was I cant catch everyone at the same time. That was beautiful, and so true. So maybe some days the mod’s have more energy or somethimg less pressing on there brain that day and we can go on and on. So all I’m saying is don’t flame anyone or you will get suspended.
Consistency some times around hear. Also I don’t know bro it did seam like you just cut and past some profile that some one had somewhere which isen’t really an opinion and not a first hand one which is what I look for not just some quote. And I got to give ya some kinda respect even though I would never go up against 2 mod’s on any subject. If 2 of them are saying the same think like SC and Trev are then I wouldn’t even risk being wrong by saying 1 thing going against what the 2 mod’s had just stated. Just me though. I have to agree and not that I have 1 ounce of first hand knowledge cuzz even though I have provin on hand I never used it yet But But
I have read multable things supporting what SC and Trev said. Sorry bud. And I don’t really see guys picking on you I think your feeling a bit to much estrogen maybe, Lol But again there does seam to be a bit of inconsistencies. Now SC sending me packing for 3 days I thought was not consistent with some other things I may have thought were grounds for action like action was brought against me.. But that’s ok. I once got pulled over by 50 for speeding and I was obviously pissed and I said to the cop “ I wasen’t the only one speeding why me?” And his response was I cant catch everyone at the same time. That was beautiful, and so true. So maybe some days the mod’s have more energy or somethimg less pressing on there brain that day and we can go on and on. So all I’m saying is don’t flame anyone or you will get suspended.
C
capospo
Guest
No problem Rocko and sensitive is not the case here. If you went to the thread I posted on here about Proviron and yes this thread is posted here on Ology, you'd see that there are MOD's and veterans saying just the opposite of what SC and Trev are saying. That is the point I'm trying to make. Both are swearing that their opinion is right and the others are BS. If I'm taking information provided other MOD's and/or Vets on this board and applying it and it's BS, then it's just the same as a newbie. Just because someone is new to a board doesn't mean they are a moron and just because someone is a MOD doesn't mean they are GOD and the authority on all subjects. If that was the case, then they all would have the same answer on certain subjects and there would be no difference in their answers. See the thread I'm talking about: http://www.steroidology.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10 All I'm saying is who am I supposed to trust on this issue. I've got on one hand several Vets saying that the other MOD's or people are misinformed and lacking knowledge on the subject of Proviron and then I got other MOD's and veterans saying the opposite. Both can't be correct. It's either black or white and cannot be both black and white. If you can explain this Rocko, please fire away. If I'm wrong about something, I have no problem with someone poking holes in what I say but I'm trying to make a point here and that's it. I get my information here from people who are supposed to know and are giving advice as MOD's and Vets. If you can't trust the answer from either one, then you basically gotta try it for yourself and see if it works. That's the point I'm trying to make.
Similar threads
