that will apply if you get shorter needles. you can get 27g 1' and 30g 1'.
tren ace: Everyday vs EOD
- Thread starter mattm
- Start date
that will apply if you get shorter needles. you can get 27g 1' and 30g 1'.
snowpatrol123
New member
12-14% is lean enough for most people, in most places (delts, pecs, bis/tris, ventroglute, lats, quads...)
If you're cutting w/ tren though a lot of people will be sub 12 and that makes even more sites available...
Get to 5-6% and probably pin your ass with a 1/2" pin if you really wanted to
Buzzbait
Killing Shit
12-14% is lean enough for most people, in most places (delts, pecs, bis/tris, ventroglute, lats, quads...)
If you're cutting w/ tren though a lot of people will be sub 12 and that makes even more sites available...
Get to 5-6% and probably pin your ass with a 1/2" pin if you really wanted to
Lol and that would be all three of y'all on this entire board. Lol, that's LEAN!!!!
3J
Super Moderator
RUNNING WITH MONSTERS:
TEST PROP, TREN ACE, AND WINNY
BY: 3J
3J's Nutrition | Diet and fitness consulting to get you to the next level.
The purpose of this article is to educate and help support the use of a very powerful cycle; Test prop, Tren ace, and Winny. The correlation of short esters, the monster that Tren is, and the drying effects of winny make this cycle great for a summer shredder. Before we get into the cycle itself, lets take about the compounds separately.
TESTOSTERONE PROPIONATE:
When it comes to compounds and stacking testosterone is king. It is the foundation which cycles are built upon. Running any compound without the use of testosterone will leave you with hormone levels similar to a females. Testosterone propionate is a fast acting ester. With a 3 day half-life, it requires a more frequent dosing schedule to reach and maintain stable blood levels. Ideally, prop should be injected every day, but every other day injections have been deemed acceptable (but not optimal). Dosages for testosterone prop range from a minimum of 50mg every other day up to 150mg every other day (some may choose to go higher, but must understand that high dosing should be reserved for very advanced bodybuilding). Estrogen side effects are an issue with prop. Though the peak values of prop are usually lower than those of longer esters, it hits you much faster. If you are sensitive to aromatization its recommended you take the necessary precautions with an SERM or AI.
TRENBOLONE ACETATE:
Trenbolone acetate, or tren ace as its more popularly known, is by far one of the most powerful injectable anabolic steroid. It is considered five times more powerful both anabolic and androgenic properties than testosterone. Tren is a derivative of testosterone. The 19th position of testosterone was altered to give us Tren. Being a 19-nor, tren is up there on the list in terms of liver toxicity. Though tren does not aromatize, it will cause a rise in progestin levels. Proper anti-estrogen/progestin drugs should be used (cabergoline or prami would be best). Tren has a very high binding affinity to the androgen receptor. It also raises igf levels in a way no other compound can (secondarily). One of the most amazing traits of Tren is its ability to increase feed efficiency. The drug allows the body to utilize more of the macro and micro nutrients you ingest, allowing you to eat less and get more out of your nutrition. Tren is well known as a recomp or hardening compound. It has been hailed as the ***8220;devils juice***8221; due to the side effects of insomnia, over-active sweat glands, and changes of temperament (it***8217;s the only steroid to show true changes in temperament). Supplementation of thyroid hormones should be used with tren since it has shown to reduce thyroid function. The acetate ester is one of the shortest esters popularly used in the bodybuilding community. Having a shorter ester than propionate (by about one day) its highly recommended that tren ace be injected daily. The ace ester allows for quick absorption of the compound if side effects occur and the user has to discontinue the drug. Since tren and testosterone fight for the same androgen receptor, its recommended that tren take the higher dosage in a cycle while testosterone takes on more of a maintenance dosage. The proper dosage of Tren ace should be no more than 50mg ed for beginners. Once you get a feel for how much you can tolerate you can slowly raise the dosage of Tren while keeping eyes on any sides that may come of it.
Winstrol (WINNY, STANOZOLOL)
Winstrol has been used by bodybuilders as a cutting steroid for years. Its known for its strong drying properties, making it ideal for those last few pounds of water weight that would usually be stubborn. It is a 17aa compound. It has been altered to survive the first pass through the liver which also makes it highly liver toxic (like most oral steroids), so the use of the injectable version is recommended. Winny also does a great job of lowering SHBG levels, keeping the body from robbing you of free testosterone. The effective dosage of winny is 50 to 100mg daily but cycles should be kept under 8 weeks due to the high toxicity of the compound.
THE PROPER TEN WEEK CYCLE
The up side of running a cycle with short esters is that you can run it shorter than a long estered cycle. Justifiably, you shouldn***8217;t need to run this cycle more than 10 weeks (though you can go as short as 6 weeks). I will set this cycle up for an every other day injection schedule to make it easier on the user. Remember that this is a beginners cycle for these compounds.
Testosterone Prop 50mg eod week 1-10
Tren Ace 75mg eod week 1-10 (dosage can be raised up to 150mg eod if the body allows without adverse side effects)
Winny 50mg ed week 2-10
Prami for progestin control should start the second week of tren at .25mg once a week (then up to twice a week if necessary) Keep in mind prami can make you feel sick. Its recommended to take it at night before you sleep. Week 2-10
HCG 250iu twice a week week 1-10
T3 25mcg ed week 1-10
PCT
Post cycle therapy should start one week after your final injection and last for 4 weeks
Clomid 100/50/50/50
Nolvadex 40/40/20/20
TEST PROP, TREN ACE, AND WINNY
BY: 3J
3J's Nutrition | Diet and fitness consulting to get you to the next level.
The purpose of this article is to educate and help support the use of a very powerful cycle; Test prop, Tren ace, and Winny. The correlation of short esters, the monster that Tren is, and the drying effects of winny make this cycle great for a summer shredder. Before we get into the cycle itself, lets take about the compounds separately.
TESTOSTERONE PROPIONATE:
When it comes to compounds and stacking testosterone is king. It is the foundation which cycles are built upon. Running any compound without the use of testosterone will leave you with hormone levels similar to a females. Testosterone propionate is a fast acting ester. With a 3 day half-life, it requires a more frequent dosing schedule to reach and maintain stable blood levels. Ideally, prop should be injected every day, but every other day injections have been deemed acceptable (but not optimal). Dosages for testosterone prop range from a minimum of 50mg every other day up to 150mg every other day (some may choose to go higher, but must understand that high dosing should be reserved for very advanced bodybuilding). Estrogen side effects are an issue with prop. Though the peak values of prop are usually lower than those of longer esters, it hits you much faster. If you are sensitive to aromatization its recommended you take the necessary precautions with an SERM or AI.
TRENBOLONE ACETATE:
Trenbolone acetate, or tren ace as its more popularly known, is by far one of the most powerful injectable anabolic steroid. It is considered five times more powerful both anabolic and androgenic properties than testosterone. Tren is a derivative of testosterone. The 19th position of testosterone was altered to give us Tren. Being a 19-nor, tren is up there on the list in terms of liver toxicity. Though tren does not aromatize, it will cause a rise in progestin levels. Proper anti-estrogen/progestin drugs should be used (cabergoline or prami would be best). Tren has a very high binding affinity to the androgen receptor. It also raises igf levels in a way no other compound can (secondarily). One of the most amazing traits of Tren is its ability to increase feed efficiency. The drug allows the body to utilize more of the macro and micro nutrients you ingest, allowing you to eat less and get more out of your nutrition. Tren is well known as a recomp or hardening compound. It has been hailed as the ***8220;devils juice***8221; due to the side effects of insomnia, over-active sweat glands, and changes of temperament (it***8217;s the only steroid to show true changes in temperament). Supplementation of thyroid hormones should be used with tren since it has shown to reduce thyroid function. The acetate ester is one of the shortest esters popularly used in the bodybuilding community. Having a shorter ester than propionate (by about one day) its highly recommended that tren ace be injected daily. The ace ester allows for quick absorption of the compound if side effects occur and the user has to discontinue the drug. Since tren and testosterone fight for the same androgen receptor, its recommended that tren take the higher dosage in a cycle while testosterone takes on more of a maintenance dosage. The proper dosage of Tren ace should be no more than 50mg ed for beginners. Once you get a feel for how much you can tolerate you can slowly raise the dosage of Tren while keeping eyes on any sides that may come of it.
Winstrol (WINNY, STANOZOLOL)
Winstrol has been used by bodybuilders as a cutting steroid for years. Its known for its strong drying properties, making it ideal for those last few pounds of water weight that would usually be stubborn. It is a 17aa compound. It has been altered to survive the first pass through the liver which also makes it highly liver toxic (like most oral steroids), so the use of the injectable version is recommended. Winny also does a great job of lowering SHBG levels, keeping the body from robbing you of free testosterone. The effective dosage of winny is 50 to 100mg daily but cycles should be kept under 8 weeks due to the high toxicity of the compound.
THE PROPER TEN WEEK CYCLE
The up side of running a cycle with short esters is that you can run it shorter than a long estered cycle. Justifiably, you shouldn***8217;t need to run this cycle more than 10 weeks (though you can go as short as 6 weeks). I will set this cycle up for an every other day injection schedule to make it easier on the user. Remember that this is a beginners cycle for these compounds.
Testosterone Prop 50mg eod week 1-10
Tren Ace 75mg eod week 1-10 (dosage can be raised up to 150mg eod if the body allows without adverse side effects)
Winny 50mg ed week 2-10
Prami for progestin control should start the second week of tren at .25mg once a week (then up to twice a week if necessary) Keep in mind prami can make you feel sick. Its recommended to take it at night before you sleep. Week 2-10
HCG 250iu twice a week week 1-10
T3 25mcg ed week 1-10
PCT
Post cycle therapy should start one week after your final injection and last for 4 weeks
Clomid 100/50/50/50
Nolvadex 40/40/20/20
Buzzbait
Killing Shit
3J please explain to me why prami or caber needs to EVER be utilized, if you are controlling E2 with an AI? Why is Dopamine Agonist, pushed so hard???
This is only personal experience, I've deca at over a gram, never had problems, but had to eat AI at higher dosages, labs of course have to be done
This is only personal experience, I've deca at over a gram, never had problems, but had to eat AI at higher dosages, labs of course have to be done
3J
Super Moderator
with the exception of letro.. the other ai's will not control prog...
its not absolutely necessary.. many people do not get side that would justify the use of a da.. but we want to play it safe and AT LEAST have it on hand
Buzzbait
Killing Shit
And by no means am I arguing the fact that da doesn't have it's place, but if E2 levels are controlled with any AI, your prolactin levels would not be an issue? I guess I'm overthinking this aspect of controlling E2, If you run dex for example at moderate dosages, and have blood ran every 6 weeks, you could monitor E2 before prolactin levels where ever to the point of needing a da.
Rida5d
city of the sun
IMO, u ll need to lower prolactin by a DA whenever running a 19 nor.
Prolactin shows itself through 2 ways : leaking nipples , and here you are right u won't have it if your E is under control , and the other face of it is the lack of sex drive..
A DA will deal with the both nasty sides, specially if E gets out of control for a reason ..
I had test e at 500 mg with no issues ..
Test p at 350 , and that's when the gyno sneaked to me..
In both cycles I was running Adex at 0.5 eod..
Think of caber as an extra seat belt.
halfwit
I like turtles.
Having a dopamine agonist on hand is wise as prolactin does NOT absolutely require elevated estradiol. It just tends to remain at manageable levels with optimal E2.
High E2 + progestin = floppy dick.
Progestin + sensitivity to prolactin = floppy dick.
Moderate E2 + progestins in higher doses = floppy dick.
As you can probably imagine, there are two ways to solve this. As most aren't willing to get tests often enough to be 100% certain they have optimal E2, tossing in a dopamine agonist takes care of the rest.
I've personally done it both ways and while I don't care for the adjustment period required by pramipexole, it is the easiest way to go. That and having the ability to have sex with little refractory time is a great way to put a smile on her face.
My .02c
High E2 + progestin = floppy dick.
Progestin + sensitivity to prolactin = floppy dick.
Moderate E2 + progestins in higher doses = floppy dick.
As you can probably imagine, there are two ways to solve this. As most aren't willing to get tests often enough to be 100% certain they have optimal E2, tossing in a dopamine agonist takes care of the rest.
I've personally done it both ways and while I don't care for the adjustment period required by pramipexole, it is the easiest way to go. That and having the ability to have sex with little refractory time is a great way to put a smile on her face.
My .02c
Buzzbait
Killing Shit
Having a dopamine agonist on hand is wise as prolactin does NOT absolutely require elevated estradiol. It just tends to remain at manageable levels with optimal E2.
High E2 + progestin = floppy dick.
Progestin + sensitivity to prolactin = floppy dick.
Moderate E2 + progestins in higher doses = floppy dick.
As you can probably imagine, there are two ways to solve this. As most aren't willing to get tests often enough to be 100% certain they have optimal E2, tossing in a dopamine agonist takes care of the rest.
I've personally done it both ways and while I don't care for the adjustment period required by pramipexole, it is the easiest way to go. That and having the ability to have sex with little refractory time is a great way to put a smile on her face.
My .02c
Ok I didn't guess I realized you could have moderate E2 and high prolactin?I Thought controling E2 would also in turn control prolactin? I'm not sensitive I'm assuming, with previously running deca at over a gram, I only ever worried about keeping e right above normal.
Last edited:
halfwit
I like turtles.
19-nors are a class of drugs called progestins. Progestins are drugs that can elevate prolactin and progesterone; what I meant by high doses of progestins would be higher cycles of deca/tren. Yes, typically if you control estradiol, prolactin will have a harder time climbing up - but, it's never a guarantee. This is why it's often recommended to keep a dopamine agonist (caber/prami) on hand.
