trt and fertility

[3J]

so ive been trying to get the wife knocked up for about 5 months now..

nothing happening lol.. i bumped my hcg from 250iu twice a week to 400iu eod about 2 months ago now.. seeing if that did the trick

on 200mg test a week right now for trt 100mg twice a week..

i was just wondering if anyone else was trying and had issues.. and what they did to resolve it

next step for me is either fsh injections or coming off for a while ..

ill be doing a semen analysis early january to see if its actually me..

 

[Bloody Q]

I've heard clomid works.

 

[3J]

Yes but wouldn't you have to come off for it to work?

 

[Bloody Q]

Yes but wouldn't you have to come off for it to work?

I guess yes.

 

[PrinceDianabol]

Yes but wouldn't you have to come off for it to work?

You would, yes. I think personally adding hMG would be the way to go mate. I'd definitely try that first before considering coming off and starting SERMs.

 

[juced_porkchop]

Yes but wouldn't you have to come off for it to work?

iv read a reports of hcg and clomid while being on hrt to have a better success rate . coming off would likely have clomid work better but it seems that even on low end hrt i seems to help. first step is the test though IMO.

 

[3J]

so start with reducing your test to maybe 50mg-70mg once a week?? add 50mg clomid eod... keep the hcg where it is??

the upgrade to hmg?

then consider coming off?

 

[PrinceDianabol]

iv read a reports of hcg and clomid while being on hrt to have a better success rate . coming off would likely have clomid work better but it seems that even on low end hrt i seems to help. first step is the test though IMO.

I daresay this would be soley due to the hCG. IMT have posted a few studies showing hCG is quite effective at bouncing fertility back. I'm not basing this on anything other than my general knowledge of the compound, but I really don't think Clomid will do anything in regard to spermatogenesis whilst the HPTA is suppressed. Even lowering the T dose shouldn't matter, suppressed is suppressed. The only way I can see Clomid helping is by stimulating gnRH, which it simply can't do on HRT.

The hCG on the other hand, definitely does work...

so start with reducing your test to maybe 50mg-70mg once a week?? add 50mg clomid eod... keep the hcg where it is??

the upgrade to hmg?

then consider coming off?

Personally, I would leave your hCG at your current upgraded dose 400iu eod and add hMG. I'm not fully clear on the dosing for hMG, but have a search around. From the few studies I have seen, it would appear both hCG + hMG are optimal for male infertility treatment.

See: Male hypogonadotropic hypogonadism: factors influencing response to human chorionic gonadotropin and human menopausal gonadotropin, including prior... - PubMed - NCBI

 

[halfwit]

I'd get the analysis done first brother. Virtually all TRT patients in the studies I've seen (that didn't have an underlying issue) were fertile from HCG alone. HMG as Prince mentioned is something I would add if the semen analysis shows low counts while on just the HCG.

The dose of test won't greatly impact your fertility in that your feedback loop is open, and FSH is going to be nil. I'm still trying to wrap my head around how HCG can induce spermatogenesis as it's only an LH analog, but the studies (IMT has a few on here as mentioned) are pretty conclusive.

 

[daleb]

Buy your own microscope, and some stain, and some slides, do your own tests. Save you the trouble of explaining to a fertility doc all the stuff you may or may not have going on. After you are done with it sell it or donate it to a school(minus the slides and stain). Some quick searching showed that it wouldnt take much doing.

I know this forum frowns on broscience - when i gnaw on celery all day it dramatically increases the fluid volume and um projectile distance.

 

[Megatron28]

I agree with HW. Get your sperm count checked at Lab Corp. The issue may not lie with you.

 

[3J]

I'd get the analysis done first brother. Virtually all TRT patients in the studies I've seen (that didn't have an underlying issue) were fertile from HCG alone. HMG as Prince mentioned is something I would add if the semen analysis shows low counts while on just the HCG.

The dose of test won't greatly impact your fertility in that your feedback loop is open, and FSH is going to be nil. I'm still trying to wrap my head around how HCG can induce spermatogenesis as it's only an LH analog, but the studies (IMT has a few on here as mentioned) are pretty conclusive.

ive been told it takes 3 months at the current dosage to see adequate spermatogenesis.. im in month 2.. though i have been sustaining 250iu twice a week for the last year..

i just dont want to be the reason why my wife cant get pregnant..

fucking women.. for the last 6 years she was dead against having children.. as in she was ok with me getting a vasectomy.. that dead against it

all of a sudden the maternal instinct has kicked in.. lol

to be honest.. im scared fucking shitless of being a parent.. esp to a little girl.. ohh god dont give me a girl

 

[Jimstigator]

I went from completely fertile to zero in about 6-8 months of TRT. Hopped on HCG at 50-60iu a day, and was back to full fertility in about 3 months. I have been fertile since (monthly testing) and have the same luck as you... no baby yet!

Even in a couple with both sides good to go, it can take years.

 

[halfwit]

ive been told it takes 3 months at the current dosage to see adequate spermatogenesis.. im in month 2.. though i have been sustaining 250iu twice a week for the last year..

i just dont want to be the reason why my wife cant get pregnant..

fucking women.. for the last 6 years she was dead against having children.. as in she was ok with me getting a vasectomy.. that dead against it

all of a sudden the maternal instinct has kicked in.. lol

to be honest.. im scared fucking shitless of being a parent.. esp to a little girl.. ohh god dont give me a girl

Universal Fact of Life: Women are crazy, men are dumb.

The problem may be in her plumbing, so I wouldn't surrender just yet to the blame game. Being a parent is some scary shit, but it can be VERY rewarding too.

Not going to lie, the best feeling in the world is when your child stops you on your way out the door to give you a hug and tell you that they love you. Those moments make it all worth it.

 

[bigben66]

Not going to lie, the best feeling in the world is when your child stops you on your way out the door to give you a hug and tell you that they love you. Those moments make it all worth it.

That's because you were stooping to go out of the door you big b*gger!

They probably thought "I'll grab him for a hug while he's down here"

 

[ChronosOceanus]

Good luck, 3J. I didn't even think about this fertility stuff until my wife wanted to get pregnant last year. After multiple semen analyses coming back with a 0 count it suddenly became important to me. I can't have biological kids, but we are looking into other options now (donor conception). Haven't done any gear or HRT/prohormone stuff at all before this, just unlucky, I guess. I don't know much about TRT other than what I've read on this forum the past couple of weeks, but you definitely won't know anything until you get that semen analysis done (or the wife gets preggers, of course).

Your comment regarding parenthood being scary reminded me of how I felt before all of this. Now that I know I can't have biological kids it doesn't seem scary at all, and I'd give anything to be able to make a little combo person of the wifey and I. Obviously, kids aren't for everyone, but if you guys are both on board it really is a gift that not everyone gets to have.

Keep us updated on how things work out, and feel free to reach out with any questions.

EDIT: Spelling

 

[IMT staff]

so ive been trying to get the wife knocked up for about 5 months now..

nothing happening lol.. i bumped my hcg from 250iu twice a week to 400iu eod about 2 months ago now.. seeing if that did the trick

on 200mg test a week right now for trt 100mg twice a week..

i was just wondering if anyone else was trying and had issues.. and what they did to resolve it

next step for me is either fsh injections or coming off for a while ..

ill be doing a semen analysis early january to see if its actually me..

Need to bump it to 1500 IU 2x a week and maybe reduce T dosage to under 150mg. If this doesn't work discontinue T and stay on the HCG alone and that should work no problem.

Hope this helps.

 

[IMT staff]

D'Agata R, Vicari E, Aliffi A, Maugeri G, Mongiol A, Gulizia S. Testicular Responsiveness to Chronic Human Chorionic Gonadotropin Administration in Hypogonadotropic Hypogonadism. J Clin Endocrinol Metab 1982;55(1):76-80.

Steroidogenic responsiveness to long term hCG administration (1500 U three times a week for 23 months) was characterized in 8 males with hypogonadotropic hypogonadism (HH). During hCG treatment, testosterone (T), which was in the prepuberal range under basal conditions, rose considerably to the upper end of the normal range and remained at that level during the 23 months of observation. A 2.5-fold increase was observed in serum levels of 17{beta}-estradiol (E2) an increment less than seen with T. The increment in 17{alpha}-hydroxyprogesterone was also lower than that in T throughout the study; thus, the 17{alpha}-hydroxyprogesterone to T ratio, despite continuous hCG administration, remained low. Serum androstenedione was slightly increased during hCG therapy. No significant changes were observed in serum levels of dehydroepiandrosterone. These data indicate that continuous long term hCG administration stimulated T levels in HH, with a relatively small change in E2. The kinetics of the T and E2 responses to 2000 U hCG, evaluated after 23 months of therapy, indicated that the testicular response was markedly reduced. No increment in T levels was observed at 24 h; the maximal response occurred at 48 h. This pattern of T response supports the idea that partial testicular desensitization occurs in HH patients receiving chronic treatment with hCG.

http://www.steroidology.com/forum/anabolic-steroid-forum/156877-hcg-desensitization-does-exist.html

Here is a study with 1500 3x per week and it kept TT in upper range for 23 months. So don't worry you will not get desensitized from it, these are actually the types of dosages that are needed to re-sensitize the testes.

 

[juced_porkchop]

so start with reducing your test to maybe 50mg-70mg once a week?? add 50mg clomid eod... keep the hcg where it is??

the upgrade to hmg?

then consider coming off?

personally i would try first with lower end hrt levels and the clomid/hcg and if nothing takes to consider getting off hrt. only because of how crappy it is to have low t levels. I know a few people on hrt that never came off it and had babies. some didnt use anything to help and some did try both or one of the above. so I would try with clomid and hcg as a first thing before going off, but thats just my personal opinion. and i may be trying it in a years or so ; )

 

[DINO-MITE]

Just my 2 cents -

(PS - nice to meet all of you! Love these forums and just registered)

1. HCG CYCLING - you should definitely CYCLE HCG. One month on, one month off, etc.

2. RESISTANCE - I wouldn't go above 350, as your body can start to go haywire with too much HCG.

3. ESTROGEN - the HCG could be increasing testosterone.... which is quickly converting into estrogen. Are you taking an anti-estrogen, like anastrozole? If you aren't, that would likely explain your sperm issues.

4. SPERM TEST - definitely get a test. Many vitamins can help with bad sperm, but finding out what's going on with your 'guys' will help greatly.

5. KIDS - I use to be afraid of children and hate kids. Then my fiancee got unexpectedly pregnant. My boy is now 3 years old and thinks I'm the most incredible dude in the world. What the other poster said above - that hug you get when you come home, from your kid who absolutely loves you? Dude.... there's no better feeling.

Good luck!