given the fact most doc's are complete garbage when it comes to this
- Thread starter lowTbraH
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Frustrated1
New member
1 by 1, 1100 a visit, months between.
like how do you know if theyre good or not
first uro i saw just gave me a script for androgel without any further testing to see why my levels were what they were
Regarding HRT, each of us is different and there is no "one-size-fits-all" approach for this.
The first thing I would suggest you do for any MD you see is to be very specific about what you want to get out of doing HRT.
Make sure you lay out your goals in terms of how you want to feel and function versus how you currently feel and function.
If you can tell your MD what you want to accomplish by undertaking a Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) protocol he/she will be much more able to help you.
So, if you are having problems in the bedroom and that is particularly important, note that and discuss what is going on with you in the that regard.
If you are struggling to maintain the energy and stamina that you had a few years ago and it is particularly important to you to feel that way again, note that for the MD.
You need to be able to articulate to your MD what your goal is and it should be more than "I want to feel good again."
I use that quote as an example because I had a friend who went to see my urologist and wanted to be put on a Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) protocol similar to mine. He told the MD, "I want to feel good again" which is valid but is of very little help for a doctor because he/she has no way of knowing what "feel good" really implies to each and every individual.
So, my point is, first and foremost, get specific and to the points that concern you the most. That is how you will get the most help in the shortest time frame.
The first thing I would suggest you do for any MD you see is to be very specific about what you want to get out of doing HRT.
Make sure you lay out your goals in terms of how you want to feel and function versus how you currently feel and function.
If you can tell your MD what you want to accomplish by undertaking a Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) protocol he/she will be much more able to help you.
So, if you are having problems in the bedroom and that is particularly important, note that and discuss what is going on with you in the that regard.
If you are struggling to maintain the energy and stamina that you had a few years ago and it is particularly important to you to feel that way again, note that for the MD.
You need to be able to articulate to your MD what your goal is and it should be more than "I want to feel good again."
I use that quote as an example because I had a friend who went to see my urologist and wanted to be put on a Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) protocol similar to mine. He told the MD, "I want to feel good again" which is valid but is of very little help for a doctor because he/she has no way of knowing what "feel good" really implies to each and every individual.
So, my point is, first and foremost, get specific and to the points that concern you the most. That is how you will get the most help in the shortest time frame.
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I would suggest you try and find a doctor or company that specifically focuses on HRT, male andropause, or Anti Aging.
They are out there. Just because a doctor is an Endo or Uro doen't necessarily mean they are up to speed on Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT).
I still think there is some gray area in this discipline so you have to educate yourself as to what your goals are and be prepared to find a medical professional that shares your goals.
My very first GP was unwilling to get my T levels over 600 and would only prescribe Testim.
This is relatively common. Once you venture into the area of Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) specialists or Anti Aging Clinics, they are very similar in their approach as it relates to basic protocols and acceptable T levels.
Here's what I have found to be common among Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) specialists/Anti Aging clinics, generally speaking...
- They are willing to prescribe injectable T and most of them prefer it
- They are willing to prescribe Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) when necessary
- They address potential estrogen side effects and at least recognize the need to test for it, if not treat it with an AI
- They are not afraid to run T levels in the upper third of the range (800-1200)
- They also address Thyroid function and will at least test for it and treat as necessary
These are very general statements and this list should not be considered exhaustive, but I have personally worked with three separate companies/doctors to treat low T and found the above to be fairly common among Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) specialists. I am also not implying that it is impossible to find an Endo or Uro that knows their shit, but I wouldn't assume it.
I have been using MaximusHRT since August with great success.
I hope this helps.
They are out there. Just because a doctor is an Endo or Uro doen't necessarily mean they are up to speed on Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT).
I still think there is some gray area in this discipline so you have to educate yourself as to what your goals are and be prepared to find a medical professional that shares your goals.
My very first GP was unwilling to get my T levels over 600 and would only prescribe Testim.
This is relatively common. Once you venture into the area of Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) specialists or Anti Aging Clinics, they are very similar in their approach as it relates to basic protocols and acceptable T levels.
Here's what I have found to be common among Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) specialists/Anti Aging clinics, generally speaking...
- They are willing to prescribe injectable T and most of them prefer it
- They are willing to prescribe Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) when necessary
- They address potential estrogen side effects and at least recognize the need to test for it, if not treat it with an AI
- They are not afraid to run T levels in the upper third of the range (800-1200)
- They also address Thyroid function and will at least test for it and treat as necessary
These are very general statements and this list should not be considered exhaustive, but I have personally worked with three separate companies/doctors to treat low T and found the above to be fairly common among Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) specialists. I am also not implying that it is impossible to find an Endo or Uro that knows their shit, but I wouldn't assume it.
I have been using MaximusHRT since August with great success.
I hope this helps.
how do i deal with them when they object to hcg?
and also they all seem to resist when i say i want injections opposed to the gel
Simple...explain your rational for why you want to use each of these products as part of your protocol.
What will they do for you and how will they benefit you and your goal.
It requires that you build your goals out with research and a rational that lets the MD know that this guy has done his homework and I can comfortably help him with what he wants to do.
He left out one option.....
find a doctor that knows what the fuck he is doing.
Sounds like you are better off continuing your search. If you and your doc aren't on the same page it is going to be a real frustrating ride for you.
BTDT.
im seeing a new endo thursday, so hopefully he's familiar with trt
the uro was adament on injections eventually destroying my testicles if i start it at age 22
Likely time to seek another MD.
Again, make sure you approach the next MD with a well-articulated plan of action that includes your goals and the hows and whys you want to employ each of the drugs you are requesting.
Think about it from the perspective of the MD for a second, you are asking for a Schedule III Control Substance that has a more negative social perception than opiates.
Any MD is going to want to feel very comfortable prescribing that type of drug to a patient.
As someone with multiple physicians in my family, I can tell you the key is to demonstrate you are knowledgeable and invested in your health and well-being.
I went to my urologist with my laptop and a
PowerPoint presentation that detailed what I wanted to do with HRT, what my goals were, and how, and why I felt what I proposed would get me to where I wanted to go.
ceomuscle58
New member
I agree with Cashout I would defiantly find another MD but position your situation with more knowledge and a better understanding of what you want to-do along with your goals for the quality of life you want!
Also I would highly recommend reading Nelson Vergel's book "Testosterone: A Man's Guide- Second Edition". This will teach you everything you need to know about HRT!!!
The Book's Link on Amazon:
Amazon.com: Testosterone: A Man's Guide- Second Edition (9780966223125): Nelson Vergel: Books
Also bring this study below from this link to explain why you want todo weekly injections along with all of your lab results from your previous doctors!
Medibolics
Infantry87
New member
Cash, I'm very interested in this as well. Not trying to hijack by any means . Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) vs testosterone replacement therapy (TRT)? Samething? As someone who has low test at 25 like me and I've even had bloods done to prove it, all they really keep doing is prescribing me shit for depression. If I've done my research correctly depression is a side of low t correct? When not on my own prescribed method of test, I always feel like crap, down, and really low libido. Seems like instead of prescribing assorted amounts of pills which can lead to birth defects , they would actually step the game up and prescribe shit that actually has uses and not a single case of damaging your health
That's what we are trying to help you with - don't say it show them the studies you've read, the details of the goals you written out, ect.
Bring all of your research and your plan with you. Let them see it...
No offense, but I get the impression you are not articulating your thoughts well while in the the MD's office and it would really serve you better to show them what you are trying to convey to them.
On top of that, at 22, you are already fighting an uphill battle in asking to be put on HRT.
You need all the support you can get.
Frustrated1
New member
No doubt about it, a ton of great information is in this thread. And yes testosterone replacement therapy (TRT) alone will kill your nads, what he forgot to tell you is that the testim and androgel will also kill your nads. Tell me again, who should have a license?
And thus the 1 by 1 begins. I've been down this road and it sucks. You can't tell them anything, because they will feel challenged. Your only hope would be what others have said on here. A well thought out proactive plan.
For the record, I'm feeling better than ever today. Maximus has me pretty dialed in now, I'm now on my 5th protocol. I've been having nighttime and morning wood, and random erections during the day since I don't know when, maybe decades. Friday I started a conversation with my bosses, bosses, bosses, boss, and introduced myself. Nice guy, we talked for about 5 or 10 minutes. My boss is worth a million or so, you can guess what each level is worth.
And thus the 1 by 1 begins. I've been down this road and it sucks. You can't tell them anything, because they will feel challenged. Your only hope would be what others have said on here. A well thought out proactive plan.
For the record, I'm feeling better than ever today. Maximus has me pretty dialed in now, I'm now on my 5th protocol. I've been having nighttime and morning wood, and random erections during the day since I don't know when, maybe decades. Friday I started a conversation with my bosses, bosses, bosses, boss, and introduced myself. Nice guy, we talked for about 5 or 10 minutes. My boss is worth a million or so, you can guess what each level is worth.
ceomuscle58
New member
Once again man I would try and convey your message better with this new doctor on Thursday and show him the facts and your labs to get your point across.
Now if he's another dumbass M.D. then I would order "Testosterone: A Man's Guide- Second Edition" ASAP and beef up your knowledge on Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) and also the books author Nelson Vergel gives his contact information in the book and is hooked up with alot of Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) doctors in the US and can find you a really good doctor in your area or pretty damn close.
To make a long story short I read his book and contacted him with my story and my specific symptoms/problems and within 2 days he replyed me back with a doctor in my area who is awesome as fuck and got me dialed in with my protocol. I can't thank him enough for helping me get my life back!
Nelson is a really solid dude who has an amazing story and you need to get his book and reach out to him for help and guidance.
Link to book:
Amazon.com: Testosterone: A Man's Guide- Second Edition (9780966223125): Nelson Vergel: Books
Now if he's another dumbass M.D. then I would order "Testosterone: A Man's Guide- Second Edition" ASAP and beef up your knowledge on Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) and also the books author Nelson Vergel gives his contact information in the book and is hooked up with alot of Hormone Replacement Therapy (HRT) doctors in the US and can find you a really good doctor in your area or pretty damn close.
To make a long story short I read his book and contacted him with my story and my specific symptoms/problems and within 2 days he replyed me back with a doctor in my area who is awesome as fuck and got me dialed in with my protocol. I can't thank him enough for helping me get my life back!
Nelson is a really solid dude who has an amazing story and you need to get his book and reach out to him for help and guidance.
Link to book:
Amazon.com: Testosterone: A Man's Guide- Second Edition (9780966223125): Nelson Vergel: Books
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just got back from an endo i first met with last week, he tested me again last week and told me to come back this week to go over the results, the test was for sex hormones or globin or something that i had yet to be tested for
i get there he tells me "i dont have access to the results, the link they sent me doesnt work, what do you want me to do"
me "wut"
i went to the fukin lab they specifically told me to go to and i scheduled this follow up to go over the results if you have a broken link thats your damn problem that you need to take care of, i dont have any ties to this lab jesus christ, the one result that had come back was the testosterone whick was 350 opposed to my other two at 148, and 172
he said that it was normal and that he wouldnt even consider treating it
i told him the normal range is garbage and i shouldnt be in the 300s at age 22 and it wouldnt be a problem if i was functioning normally in the 300s but im in there for symptoms that correlate with low testosterone before i even know that im at the low end
i was pretty agitated and he tells me that in his opinion this is an anger issue more than a testosterone issue, took all my will power not to do physical harm to this man
i get there he tells me "i dont have access to the results, the link they sent me doesnt work, what do you want me to do"
me "wut"
i went to the fukin lab they specifically told me to go to and i scheduled this follow up to go over the results if you have a broken link thats your damn problem that you need to take care of, i dont have any ties to this lab jesus christ, the one result that had come back was the testosterone whick was 350 opposed to my other two at 148, and 172
he said that it was normal and that he wouldnt even consider treating it
i told him the normal range is garbage and i shouldnt be in the 300s at age 22 and it wouldnt be a problem if i was functioning normally in the 300s but im in there for symptoms that correlate with low testosterone before i even know that im at the low end
i was pretty agitated and he tells me that in his opinion this is an anger issue more than a testosterone issue, took all my will power not to do physical harm to this man
The best thing my first Doctor ever did for me was to piss me off enough to look for another doctor/specialist.
Sounds like this doc has given you all the confirmation you need that he is a waste of time.
My best advice is simply to move on.
Keep searching. A lot providers have websites that will allow you to do some measure of pre-screening prior to your first appointment.
Instead of serching for an Endo or Uro, google male hormone therapy, or Andropause, or bioidentical hormone replacement therapy for your metro area.
Just my .02
Good luck....
