Guys I have a Propionate Question

[The Answer]

For those that have used testosterone phenylpropionate and Test Prop.....whats your preferrence as a hardening agent. I would like to hear any differences you might have encountered between these different yet similar products.....

Thanks
TA

 

[LAWNSAVER]

Neither will harden you without the use of a anti-A. They both aromatize to estrogen fast! If you dont control that, you will be bloated!

 

[Brett_Weir]

Agreed.......What would be the prefered anti-estrogen???

 

[SNAKEMAN]

im on prop at the moment and using arimidex @ 1mg /day and its working great

 

[Tattoomeblew]

im on prop at the moment and using arimidex @ 1mg /day and its working great

me 2 and i agree arimadex works for water sides from the conversion.

 

[Hammer]

Have some nolvadex handy also

 

[dutch windmill]

I think the use of anti)e's is severely over rated these days..you do need estrogens to gain weight...the problem is that yoiu keep taking stuff to fight side-effects and you use some other products to fight that..in the end..where is the end?..i only use femara or nolva when i really feel i need them..

D.W.

 

[saturn]

I have been struggleing with this question also. I usully don't run any anti-es (anti-as) with my cycle and keep nolva on hand just in case. I have always accepted water bloat as somthing that happes and will go away quickly after my cycle is over. I will be starting my next cycle in a couple days but I'm not looking forward to the water gains that usually come with test prop (or any AS for that matter).

I guess my opinion is that anti-es during the cycle may hinder possible gains so I haven't run them with my cycle.
I would also like to hear other opinions on the subject though.

 

[rj420]

I think AI's (aromatase inhibitors) have their place... but many times they are used in excessive amounts. I am very prone to estro sides, and .5mg/adex/day was plenty on 800mg/test.

Benefits to keeping off the bloat and raised estro levels: less fat accumulation, especially in estro related patterning (hips/abdomen/face/neck/obliques)... easier fat loss with high androgen:low estrogen ratio. Rapid water gain is also a contributor to stretch marks. Water retention is a big factor in increased BP.

People will also be less suspicious, if you must hide your Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) usage.

Benefits of aromatization: water retention is a main contributor to increased strength due to intracellular pressure... causes increase in cellular leverage. Better joint lubrication. Estro is essential for hormonal regulations and increases glucose metabolization/uptake.

IMO, its an individual decision. For me, I like to use a moderate dose of an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) to avoid any gyno and estro fat gain, which I am prone to.

 

[buffdoc]

I was using higher doses of Arimidex for a while, and it seemed to be playing hell w/ my HDL levels. I decided to back off a little, and I'm using my wedding band as an indicator!
If the ring goes on and off (I take it off to shower, not to go out!) with ease, I'm not bloating. If it's tight, I titrate in a little A-dex, which has a fairly long half life anyway. Sometimes one or two doses are all that's required for me, and I'm back on track and testing my rings again everyday.
Crazy? Wishful thinking? Comments please.

PS: I have pretty low body fat, so the estrogenic fat's not a big issue. Don't seem to be gyno prone either.

 

[LAWNSAVER]

Guys...Guys...you are getting way off track! He asked how to stay hard when taking either types of test. To stay hard, he must control the estrogen. Of course you need some for growth...of course Anti-A's have some sides, but that wasnt the question

 

[buffdoc]

Guys...Guys...you are getting way off track! He asked how to stay hard when taking either types of test. To stay hard, he must control the estrogen. Of course you need some for growth...of course Anti-A's have some sides, but that wasnt the question

Actually, his original question was about the difference BETWEEN prop and phenylprop as hardening agents. Lawnsavers response was: you need an anti-e, which sent the thread this way.
So, anyone w/ ideas about prop vs phenylprop?
Or , is the issue test is test, and what do we do to harden in that context?

 

[natty]

who makes phenylprop?

I have only used prop and can say it made me pretty hard, though the best hardness i have gotten was Winny/Proviron

 

[Juice Authority]

For those that have used testosterone phenylpropionate and Test Prop.....whats your preferrence as a hardening agent. I would like to hear any differences you might have encountered between these different yet similar products.....

Thanks
TA

Out of curiousity why Prop for a hardening agent? I like D-bol for this. Dbol raises dopamine which aids in fat burning. It also suppresses appetite for a lot of people. Take something to control estrogen, and it's fine for cutting.

I have used test prop before as a kickstart like I am now. For Instance if u are taking a long acting ester such as Sustanon (sust), 4 weeks to get out of system or before u can get on clomid...in those 4 weeks, is it beneficial to hit prop at something like 400 mgs a week until the week before clomid, so u do not lose much of your gains b/c prop is keeping test up until you try and get HPTA back to normal.