Oxandrolone could be taken all year round

[Jeff_rys]

Re: Re: Oxandrolone could be taken all year round

This is some of the most idiotic advise I've read in some time.

Not only are your facts wrong but 14 pounds in 12 weeks? Fuck, you can gain that in that much time with NO gear.
Sounds like you've been listening to that moron "Fonz" over at Elite. Don't.

Ok, you got my attention:
1) Ox does NOT affect your liver values
2) Sure you can gain 14 pounds in 12 weeks without gear. BUT someone who is at his limit of gains WITHOUT gear, can gain 14 pounds on it WITH OX.
3) Are you sure to gain 14 pounds of muscle in 12 weeks WITHOUT gear.
4) Fonz certainly is NOT a moron. I do not visit EF anymore since some 24 months.
5) What i said was MY personal experience, not that of Fonz.
6) i never encourage people do to what i did, feel free to do so, but at your own risk.
7) the idiotic advice is not an advice, it is the thruth, i repeat, i do not encourage anyone to do anything. Take my "post" for whatever you want, but do not call me a liar.
8) next week i will post something on Winstrol (winny). I bet you will be even more surprised than now.

Jeff

 

[Jeff_rys]

For everyone here on the board, let me add a line here:

I only speak of "gear" i used. I only tell the thruth. I state what i mean, what i believe. I will not fool around and make "blabla" statements to get attention. You get it like it is.
This does not mean, ANYONE must believe what i say or agree with it. But if you do NOT believe what i say, i hope YOU too will speak out of experience, not from " HEAR SAY".

Thanks,

Jeff

 

[DrJMW]

Oxandrolone is probably the safest AAS. It doesn't aromatize to estrogen, it doesn't stimulate progesterone/prolactin release, and it doesn't convert to DHT. It does, like all AAS, suppress the HPTA. It is kind to the liver at doses below 40mg, but as an oral, it does negatively effect the cholesterol levels at dosing of 30-40mg+ and sometimes lower. Lastly, it isn't as anabolic as Testos and DECA and a host of others.

 

[Biceps_Blitz]

Oxymethalone is ANADROL and is quite different from anavar ( oxandralone )

ooooohhhh I'm sorry man, a big misunderstanding. Yeah oxandrolone is indeed one of the mildest drugs around. Sorry bro

 

[Nelson Montana]

Re: Re: Re: Oxandrolone could be taken all year round

Nelson, I hadn't realized you had brought your toxic personality to this board.

Lucky me.

I would have thought you would have learned from having your ass handed to you at EF.

If when you say I had "my ass handed to me", you mean there were lies told about me, accusing me of things that never occurred, jealous mods getting on my case for not having credentials that are a matter of record, other mods who feared the Protein Factory products I developed were working too well altering my posts to try and make me look bad, my offering insights instead of cutting and pasting, and having some people ganging up on me because they could not comprehend half of what I was saying...then yes, I got my ass handed to me.

It's also funny that just recently read a post by someone who vehemently argued against me and is now espousing the very same points I made and the flock is getting in line to kiss his ass. Sheep. Nothing but mindless sheep.

As for Fonz, he's an egomaniacal kid who steals information word for word and presents it as his own studies. He has admittedly done fina for six months straight and weighs a whopping 165 pounds. (He advises others to do the same) And let's not forget his statments that oxandrolone IMPROVES liver values!!! I maintain, he's a moron. He does however tell everyone how brilliant he is even though he's never published anything. And people get in line to kiss his ass.
Mindless fucking sheep.

Jeff: I am not calling you a liar. I believe you're sincere. You're just wrong.

 

[EZstreet]

Just have to chime in hear. I had between 2-3k btg's ox i went through. Which was about 3 months and my liver enzymes were wacked.

 

[Lunkhead]

Oxandrolone is probably the safest AAS. It doesn't aromatize to estrogen, it doesn't stimulate progesterone/prolactin release, and it doesn't convert to DHT. It does, like all AAS, suppress the HPTA. It is kind to the liver at doses below 40mg, but as an oral, it does negatively effect the cholesterol levels at dosing of 30-40mg+ and sometimes lower. Lastly, it isn't as anabolic as Testos and DECA and a host of others.

I run oxandrolone in my critically ill burn patients at 0.25-0.5 mg/kg/day depending on their nitrogen balance. The drug is continued for 6 months + at this dose. I've never seen a single adverse event attributable to this drug in over 500 cases and these guys are SICK. They have bloodwork done at least daily during this time. This is when oxandrolone is the sole Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) used although the patients are always taking many other drugs such as antibiotics, inotropic agents, diuretics etc. I have colleagues who have had similar clinical experience with much higher doses of 'var in HIV patients with HIV wasting syndrome (> 100 mg/day in some cases!).

Dr. V's observation re: drug interactions while stacking with other agents is a good point-- it may potentiate other AAS's hepatotoxicity. I also notice that 'var seems to make my BP go up when I have test in the background. I don't really understand this unless there's an interaction at cytochrome P450 in the liver or displacement from SHBG.

As always, caution is advised. I think 'var only cycles are safe for most people; however, I'd definitely monitor my BP with a home monitor daily and get at least q 3 monthly bloodwork (assuming values are stable).

my $ .02

l

 

[Powerhouse9]

$900 a great price, but expensive non the less.

 

[iamcdn]

I run oxandrolone in my critically ill burn patients at 0.25-0.5 mg/kg/day depending on their nitrogen balance. The drug is continued for 6 months + at this dose. I've never seen a single adverse event attributable to this drug in over 500 cases and these guys are SICK. They have bloodwork done at least daily during this time. This is when oxandrolone is the sole Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) used although the patients are always taking many other drugs such as antibiotics, inotropic agents, diuretics etc. I have colleagues who have had similar clinical experience with much higher doses of 'var in HIV patients with HIV wasting syndrome (> 100 mg/day in some cases!).

Dr. V's observation re: drug interactions while stacking with other agents is a good point-- it may potentiate other AAS's hepatotoxicity. I also notice that 'var seems to make my BP go up when I have test in the background. I don't really understand this unless there's an interaction at cytochrome P450 in the liver or displacement from SHBG.

As always, caution is advised. I think 'var only cycles are safe for most people; however, I'd definitely monitor my BP with a home monitor daily and get at least q 3 monthly bloodwork (assuming values are stable).

my $ .02

l

what times of day do you recommend measuring blood pressure

 

[StoneColdNTO]

what times of day do you recommend measuring blood pressure

IMO......what's important is that you measure it at the same time of day, every day. The actual time doesn't really matter, it is the consistency that does.

 

[Lunkhead]

SC is right. For practical purposes, do it when you can.

The AHA recommends that you take it each morning, half an hour after you get up, drained the main vein and before you have coffee. There are a significant percentage of people who have an am spike in BP.

that's when i do it.

 

[SweetLeaf]

I don't understand how a 17aa Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) can be safe....We hear so much about orals being so toxic that the thought of taking orals is just scary. Winstrol (winny) is harsh on the liver, so what is the difference with var...they are both 17aa. Can anyone clear this up?

 

[Jeff_rys]

Well Nelson, as said i know Fonz from EF (again, it has been 2 years, and AF). Recently for personal reasons i needed some help and i recontacted Fonz. He helped me out of course.
Anyway, i do agree with him about liver values can be improved with Ox. We where on EF together when i was doing the 8 months.

I am not saying that everyone will react the same as i do, BUT he who wants to stay on for a serious time or bridge for a long time, must do this with Ox, no question about it. Now to be extra safe one should take (and i will repeat this again and again) L-Reduced Glutathion or R-Ala or even Lysomucil (you need a doc for this). Lysomucil needs to be taken within the 8 hours of intoxication. In extreme cases there also is Lysomucil for injection RIGHT IN THE VEIN. Do not do this yourself, please.

I will include a URL:

http://www.intense-training.com/forums/showthread.php3?s=&threadid=2915

There are studies on the internet saying kids can be threated with Ox, meanwhile improving liver values.

But if you know a roid that is safer then Ox, please say it here on the board. Don't give me the Primobolan sh*t, Ox is safer.

Jeff

 

[Drveejay11]

I run oxandrolone in my critically ill burn patients at 0.25-0.5 mg/kg/day depending on their nitrogen balance. The drug is continued for 6 months + at this dose. I've never seen a single adverse event attributable to this drug in over 500 cases and these guys are SICK. They have bloodwork done at least daily during this time. This is when oxandrolone is the sole Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) used although the patients are always taking many other drugs such as antibiotics, inotropic agents, diuretics etc. I have colleagues who have had similar clinical experience with much higher doses of 'var in HIV patients with HIV wasting syndrome (> 100 mg/day in some cases!).

Dr. V's observation re: drug interactions while stacking with other agents is a good point-- it may potentiate other AAS's hepatotoxicity. I also notice that 'var seems to make my BP go up when I have test in the background. I don't really understand this unless there's an interaction at cytochrome P450 in the liver or displacement from SHBG.

As always, caution is advised. I think 'var only cycles are safe for most people; however, I'd definitely monitor my BP with a home monitor daily and get at least q 3 monthly bloodwork (assuming values are stable).

WOW----good stuff Lunkhead.

 

[Nelson Montana]

Well Nelson, as said i know Fonz from EF (again, it has been 2 years, and AF). Recently for personal reasons i needed some help and i recontacted Fonz. He helped me out of course.
Anyway, i do agree with him about liver values can be improved with Ox. We where on EF together when i was doing the 8 months.

I am not saying that everyone will react the same as i do, BUT he who wants to stay on for a serious time or bridge for a long time, must do this with Ox, no question about it. Now to be extra safe one should take (and i will repeat this again and again) L-Reduced Glutathion or R-Ala or even Lysomucil (you need a doc for this). Lysomucil needs to be taken within the 8 hours of intoxication. In extreme cases there also is Lysomucil for injection RIGHT IN THE VEIN. Do not do this yourself, please.

I will include a URL:

http://www.intense-training.com/forums/showthread.php3?s=&threadid=2915

There are studies on the internet saying kids can be threated with Ox, meanwhile improving liver values.

But if you know a roid that is safer then Ox, please say it here on the board. Don't give me the Primobolan sh*t, Ox is safer.

Jeff

Okay, keep telling yourself that.

First of all, the study that started Fonz into believing that Ox improved liver values was done with people with wasting disease and cirrosis of the liver from alcoholism. It was the fact that they stopped drinking that caused the improved liver values, not the use of the ox. Anyone with any common sense could figure this out but some scientists, psuedo scientists, and make believe internet scientists like Fonz don't get it. Then he pollutes the minds of naive followers who are impressed that he knows more than them, even if most of what he knows is wrong.

Ox CAN NOT improve liver values. That's just stupid. By nature of it being 17 AA it is liver toxic. You know, some people don't get elevated liver enzymes from alcohol, that does't mean it isn't toxic. And if someone went from drinking a quart of Scotch a day to a pint of Bourbon, they'd show improved liver enzymes. That doesn't mean Bourbon improves it!

This is one of those things that you either get or you don't get. Or don't want to get.

 

[DrJMW]

Nelson is correct. Anyone that understands the pharamcology of oral medications knows about the concept of "multiple pass-through's." All orals require the liver to convert (conjugate) them into the active form of the drug. Injectables bypass the liver and enter the blood stream in their active form. The less one uses his liver, the healthier it remains.

 

[Mudge]

Winny is harsh on the liver, so what is the difference with var...they are both 17aa. Can anyone clear this up?

A doc I spoke with said that 17aa to 17aa is not that simple to compare, you cant just look at mg to mg. Maybe its close in some cases, but certainly not all. This doc (female) believed that anadrol was also harsher due to the ring style, which I think she said was similar to cholesterol but hell I'm not a doc so I didn't memorize everything she said, I could probably dig it up though.

One thing to be said for this whole thread is we are individuals, not everyone has the same liver. You may be able to blindly follow what someone else has done and be safe, you may not. Some people have high liver values without even knowing it, and without using drugs or drinking.

Know thyself.

 

[DrJMW]

It is the drug's chemical structure that makes a difference as well--not jsut oral vs injectable. All AAS, including Test, looks like cholesterol, because the body's uses cholesterol as the building block for Testosterone and a host of other things.

 

[Faye]

Mudge - Word.

 

[TxLonghorn]

Ok, I've got a question for jeff. You were on for 8 months, and yet your gains leveled off at 4 months, correct? If you had this to do again, would you do it for 8 months straight again, or would you do 2 4 month cycles?

Why would you choose one over the other?

Also...how difficult was it to restore your hpta after 8 months on?