Something I really don't get about mass gains

[Repo]

I think I just pissed on myself laughing at that picture.

LOL - That makes two of us!!!

 

[robbiek426]

Hey bro, give us some stats. Come back when you know your weight and all that good stuff! Its pretty important to know a starting weight prior to a cycle. I never notice my gains (partly because I am already huge) but the scale and the tape dont lie about gains. Well thats not true, you can hold water. But its a rough indication of whether you are accomplishing your goals. You cant have an "I dont care" attitude when it comes to stats. Stats are why we do this. I could give someone veggie oil and tell them to eat 2k calories more a day and 2g's protien per lbs of lean body mass and watch them get bigger. Its important to know where you start. If your not going to pay attention to that.............would you like to buy some veggie oil with a meal plan?

 

[hatefulONE]

How old do we all guess? 20? At that weight there is no reason to even consider using anything hormonal. Hell even taking premarin might help atleast add some water weight to you. If you can easily eat 5,000 cals a day, then do it, its not as easy as it seems. Especially if they are the right kind of calories, timed appropriately, etc. At that size though even the wrong types of food at 5,000 cals a day will put some lean mass on you if you workout correctly, but at that size there is something wrong with every aspect of your training regime.

 

[cheppallet]

exactly

we all have a hormonal govenor in our body that is genetically set

so all other variables constant(diet, rest,training, etc) the only thing that changes is your hormones

once we stop the hormone supplementation, our bodys recover(hopefully) back to the hormonal govenor and over time, the bodys muscles will respond to that limit

some guys say, u have to eat more coming off cycle, but thats just adjusting your diet, something that can be done independent of hormone supplementation

this couldn't be more incorrect. Homeostasis can be fought and overcome if you know how to do it. There are plenty of guys out there that have acclimated their bodies to a new weight over time and have stayed much bigger than they did when they started.

unless I'm reading you wrong, but it sounds like you are saying whatever you gain from gear you will eventually lose if you ever come off. If that is what you are saying... I'm sorry, but you are sadly mistaken.

hormonal governor. I do like that though. Hilarious.

 

[DADAWG]

this couldn't be more incorrect. Homeostasis can be fought and overcome if you know how to do it. There are plenty of guys out there that have acclimated their bodies to a new weight over time and have stayed much bigger than they did when they started.

unless I'm reading you wrong, but it sounds like you are saying whatever you gain from gear you will eventually lose if you ever come off. If that is what you are saying... I'm sorry, but you are sadly mistaken.

hormonal governor. I do like that though. Hilarious.

i think hes reffering to the fact that the dude doesnt eat right so even if he gains a little on cycle it will come back off. the dude is a bean pole he cant be eating enough to maintain mass.

 

[cjw2021]

you can gain as fast as you want provided you eat enough cals.

 

[Dave1]

Just weighed myself... 186lbs. I couldn't judge what I weighed. i thought I may of been lower than that because I have low bf but at least I know I'm not 160. That's 26lbs heavier than I thought. Feels pretty good

 

[cheppallet]

Just weighed myself... 186lbs. I couldn't judge what I weighed. i thought I may of been lower than that because I have low bf but at least I know I'm not 160. That's 26lbs heavier than I thought. Feels pretty good

how can you NOT know you weigh 186lbs and think you weigh 160lbs? this has got to be the worst thread ive seen.

 

[5x10]

this couldn't be more incorrect. Homeostasis can be fought and overcome if you know how to do it. There are plenty of guys out there that have acclimated their bodies to a new weight over time and have stayed much bigger than they did when they started.

unless I'm reading you wrong, but it sounds like you are saying whatever you gain from gear you will eventually lose if you ever come off. If that is what you are saying... I'm sorry, but you are sadly mistaken.

hormonal governor. I do like that though. Hilarious.

so how do you do it?
have you taken years off of any hormones? and how long were you on the cycle prior to coming off for extended amounts of time?
all my cycles were 10-12 week cycles
i did my 1st cycle at 21
the next cycle i was 28
now i am 32

when i started my cycle at 28, i can tell you for a fact that i wasnt anywhere near what i had coming off cycle at 21

when i started my cycle at 32, i wasnt anywhere near where i was when i was 28 coming off cycle
in fact, i was at my strongest when i was younger and able to fully focus on diet and training(independent of any steroids)
so, thats why i need the secret to keep the hormonally induced gains(besides using hormones, hgh, igf, etc)

 

[5x10]

i think hes reffering to the fact that the dude doesnt eat right so even if he gains a little on cycle it will come back off. the dude is a bean pole he cant be eating enough to maintain mass.

this is my point

with all other variables constant(diet, training, rest, etc) the only thing changing are hormones

if you change your diet, you can make more gains, all independent of hormones

most people that i know that cycle leave all other varibales constant(other than the increased appetite/training intensity while on)

so unless they have gone through a Eureka moment while on cycle and suddenyl discover how to eat right, they will go back down to what they were before

and if they do change their diet, i would be willing to give credit to diet for the gains, not the hormones

 

[cheppallet]

so how do you do it?
have you taken years off of any hormones? and how long were you on the cycle prior to coming off for extended amounts of time?
all my cycles were 10-12 week cycles
i did my 1st cycle at 21
the next cycle i was 28
now i am 32

when i started my cycle at 28, i can tell you for a fact that i wasnt anywhere near what i had coming off cycle at 21

when i started my cycle at 32, i wasnt anywhere near where i was when i was 28 coming off cycle
in fact, i was at my strongest when i was younger and able to fully focus on diet and training(independent of any steroids)
so, thats why i need the secret to keep the hormonally induced gains(besides using hormones, hgh, igf, etc)

its called not relying on gear for your gains, yet relying on diet and training... and only using gear as a tool to help gain more than you would naturally.

I have read your other posts on this, so i don't want you to think I'm being a dick by disagreeing with you, as i think you have some very valid points. Its just that you are wrong in terms of keeping those gains.

If you recover properly to a baseline or better test level (assuming you had one pre-cycle), there is no reason you can't gain naturally AFTER you have come off cycle. The biggest problem is guys who use gear make several bad mistakes.

1. They assume bodyweight gained is muscle weight. Thats why you hear "I gained 30lbs and kept a solid 20lbs in 12 weeks." This unfortunately is nonsense. No one is gaining that amount of solid muscle in 12 weeks, I don't care who it is. That 20lbs is a mix of fat, muscle and water, most of that water lost post cycle.

2. They turn into a shitbag post cycle and don't eat as much as they should, don't continue to train hard, and basically let their mind fail them and the body just follows. They spend all that time worrying about what a scale says and they let it mind fuck them.

3. They don't have an initial baseline test done, nor do alot of them get bloodwork done post cycle to ensure they are on the path to a proper recovery. Here's the kicker. Just because you take a SERM, and your test levels are back to normal, doesn't mean your body has regulated. it takes time to recover to a point that you can start gaining naturally again.

4. They rely on gear for their gains. This is the yo-yo effect you see with so many guys out there who juice. They have no idea how to diet or train properly so they in essence are wasting their time just for some fat, water and acne.

I understand you're point about all variables being constant, but stasis can be defeated and you can hold onto those gains you have made well beyond post cycle. I was in a bad accident over a year ago, and i have almost lost all the fat i gained being bed-ridden, but that muscle is still there. And its because i spent years training my ass off for it before i even touched the first cc of gear, and i continued to do so year after year.

It can be done. Damn good discussion by the way. Well, 5x10, not the original guy who weighs less than my sister.

 

[5x10]

It can be done. Damn good discussion by the way. Well, 5x10, not the original guy who weighs less than my sister.

what? the original guy?


as with hormones, everything i said in previous posts can also apply to diet

you have your diet dialed in, you can achieve alot, but to a point

you dont keep up with your diet and your body will reflect that
if you weigh x amt on x calories and x protein, then you would also expect to not be able to maintain that weight with 40% of x
just like hormones

 

[cheppallet]

what? the original guy?


as with hormones, everything i said in previous posts can also apply to diet

you have your diet dialed in, you can achieve alot, but to a point

you dont keep up with your diet and your body will reflect that
if you weigh x amt on x calories and x protein, then you would also expect to not be able to maintain that weight with 40% of x
just like hormones

i was saying the original poster. Dave1 or whatever. The guy who doesn't know how much he weighs. Never mind man.

Again, you are right about diet, but that has nothing to do with what we're talking about here. Keeping gains made from gear is done all the time, even after you come off those hormones and your body settles into its natural state. If that doesn't work for you... you're doing something wrong.

Homeostasis is a bitch, and its hard to fight, but its done all the time. The key is acclimating to those new gains. This is one reason 10-12 week cycles aren't that great in terms of keeping gains. But thats a whole other thread.

 

[5x10]

i was saying the original poster. Dave1 or whatever. The guy who doesn't know how much he weighs. Never mind man.

Again, you are right about diet, but that has nothing to do with what we're talking about here. Keeping gains made from gear is done all the time, even after you come off those hormones and your body settles into its natural state. If that doesn't work for you... you're doing something wrong.

Homeostasis is a bitch, and its hard to fight, but its done all the time. The key is acclimating to those new gains. This is one reason 10-12 week cycles aren't that great in terms of keeping gains. But thats a whole other thread.

a whole other thread that needs to be titled "the law of averages"