Topicals and DHT
- Thread starter coolhandjames
- Start date
coolhandjames
I am b@nned !
anyone care to enlighten some minds?
guambomb
Disciplined & Consistent
coolhandjames
I am b@nned !
This is an excerpt from the URL above. ^^^^^^^
If you are concerned about gyno, avoid finesteride at all costs. It lowers all 5a-reduced metabolites to undesirable levels and has an extremely long half-life which continues to suppress DHT levels long after discontinuing the drug. (9) Progesterone would be a better anti-DHT alternative if you are concerned with hair loss. Plus, progesterone can clear the system within 24hrs making a mistake in dosing much less risky
If you are concerned about gyno, avoid finesteride at all costs. It lowers all 5a-reduced metabolites to undesirable levels and has an extremely long half-life which continues to suppress DHT levels long after discontinuing the drug. (9) Progesterone would be a better anti-DHT alternative if you are concerned with hair loss. Plus, progesterone can clear the system within 24hrs making a mistake in dosing much less risky
Stick & Move
I am banned!
I've ran my tren as high as 600/ week and test as high as 800 / week and never notice gyno. I'm not worried about gyno. Now what?
guambomb
Disciplined & Consistent
well, for what it's worth--don't drink excessive amounts of grapefruit juice while taking finasteride.
This will inhibit the enzyme that normally degrades finasteride, thus extending its half life.
it's good to hear you can make good gains while using tren and test and suffer no sides of gyno symptoms.
I just wanted to make mention of finasteride + grapefruit juice because I got a little bit of nipple puffiness a while ago as a result. I was not using any steroids or any OTC supplements that could have contributed to this event. I just wanted to drink grapefruit juice for a couple days (finished a half-gallon in 2-3 days) and I started noticing symptoms within a day or so. The symptoms resided in about 4-5 days, but it still put the fear of gyno in my mind and so now I am really careful about these things.
This will inhibit the enzyme that normally degrades finasteride, thus extending its half life.
it's good to hear you can make good gains while using tren and test and suffer no sides of gyno symptoms.
I just wanted to make mention of finasteride + grapefruit juice because I got a little bit of nipple puffiness a while ago as a result. I was not using any steroids or any OTC supplements that could have contributed to this event. I just wanted to drink grapefruit juice for a couple days (finished a half-gallon in 2-3 days) and I started noticing symptoms within a day or so. The symptoms resided in about 4-5 days, but it still put the fear of gyno in my mind and so now I am really careful about these things.
coolhandjames
I am b@nned !
I've been doing reading on other boards... alot of guys are saying fina with an AI= bad news.... but again still reading
This quote is inaccurate - the half-life of fina is 8 hours and it doesn't reduce system DHT levels to an undesirable level even when run at 5 mg daily.
The author is confusing fina and duta. Duta has a very long half life - months - and eliminates both Type I and Type II 5-AR enzymes. Fina at 1 mg daily will reduced between 55-70% of Type I isoenzyme. At a 70% reduction, most users will be a the lower end of the "normal" blood level range.
As for fina and an Aromatase inhibitor (AI), there is no interaction that would be an issue at all - two totally unrelated reduction pathways the 5-AR and the 3- HD.
Fina or Duta themselves do not cause gyno.
Both Fina and Duta will INCREASE the total Test in one's body because they inhibit Test from converting to DHT.
That means that there is more Test available to convert to estrogen.
The solution, if you are suspect to gyno, is use and AI.
Fina + Aromatase inhibitor (AI) = less test being wasted by conversion to DHT & Estrogen
Wow! There is too much misinformation on that page to address all of it in a post!
The author might want to start by understanding the actions of 5-AR enzyme. This would be a good beginning.
Olsen EA, Hordinsky M, Whiting D, et al. (Dec 2006). "The importance of dual 5alpha-reductase inhibition in the treatment of MPB: results of a randomized placebo-controlled study of dutasteride versus finasteride". J Am Acad Dermatol. 55 (6)
http://www.eblue.org/article/S0190-9622(06)01287-4/abstract
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guambomb
Disciplined & Consistent
thanks for putting that extra information out there cashout. I just want to be clear that I had not intended to state that finasteride has a DIRECT effect of causing gyno symptoms. I'm aware of increased Test levels leading to more conversion to estrogens.
One thing I want to get clear though--are you suggesting running a 5-alpha reductase inhibitor and using an Aromatase inhibitor (AI) as needed (when running a cycle)?
coolhandjames
I am b@nned !
It would seem if your body wants to shed its hair its going to.
Diet seems to play a part though. "Healthy man healthy beard"... so the saying goes... has to be the same with hair....no?
Diet seems to play a part though. "Healthy man healthy beard"... so the saying goes... has to be the same with hair....no?
Yes - 5-AR and Aromatase inhibitor (AI) are a-okay together.
Actually, the hair on the temporal region of one's head is different from the hair on other parts of the body.
The follicles on the temporal are what is known as velum follicles and are very suspect to DHT.
The hair follicles elsewhere are what is known as terminal follicles and have no DHT issues - think eyebrows - those never fall out - the follicles themselves are different in structure and have no receptors for DHT.
coolhandjames
I am b@nned !
Yeah cash what are you are doctor or a specialist or something?
Stick & Move
I am banned!
Where are you looking for the 10%. A quick google search brings up many options.
Hey cashout, or Dr. Hair, would it be a bad idea to use duta sense it has a very long half life? Also I can't seem to find 10% minoxidil by Rogain. All I see is 5%
I recommend duta in very few cases. Not so much b/c of the half life but because it reduces your Type I & II isoenzymes of DHT to a point where it is not beneficial for most. If you are prone to MPB and have issues with DHT in other ways - i.e. severe androgenic acne or prostate (BPE). Then duta at .5 mg EOD. Beyond that duta is too powerful for just the casual AAS user looking to stave off hair loss.
Remember, we don't want to wipe out DHT, we just want to keep in it the low end of the normal range.
Hey cashout, or Dr. Hair
Sorry I meant 5%. My bad.
Cashout if a guy did use duta and didn't have any of the above symptoms could you get away with dosing every third day or is it still to strong and pointless. I have a bunch of it left over and have switched to fina after our previous conversations but I'm trying to decide if I should trash what I have left, 8 bottles, or I have a friend who wants to use it for the same reason and I'm not so sure I should be giving it to him either. Any recommendation on a safer way to use it, safer meaning not killing dht levels too much??
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