Var and ECA. How does this look...

[MS1605]

Well over the years I have done Every OTC Prohormone/Mass gaining product to hit the shelves. The one thing I couldnt shake is putting on fat with the muscle. No matter how lean my diet was, if i was eating enough to gian muscle i was putting on fat. So after years of doing this its time to get lean.

I know, i know. Anavar is a horrable first REAL gear choice. I have thought about this for almost 2 years now. But after I ran my last cycle of 1t tren and havoc and gained 15lbs of muscle mass and 10 of fat, im going to just do it.

So im thinking it should look something like this:

-Var 50MG ED x 8W
-ECA 2 weeks on 2 weeks off x 8W (so 2 "cycles")

The reason im pushing the ECA so much is my body reacts REALLY well to stims. I dont get any headaches, no jitters nothing from them. That being said ECA crushes my apatite. Im looking to get real low cal intake on this. Im hoping with the Var I can get down to 1500Cals/day and not go catabolit?

As for post cycle therapy (pct), From what I can read var is rediculously mild. I lot of sites that i have been reading through posts on say you dont even need post cycle therapy (pct) on var at this dose. I want to know what you guys think. I have Nolv and HCG on hand. Anything else you would suggest at this dose.

Stats.

24 YO
5'11''
225lbs
18%bf
fat ass...

For my weekly routine right now im doing 2 days of MMA (which I consider my cardio) for 2.5 hours each session.

Then ill do whole body days 2 times a week that last about 1.5 hours.


Like I said, I KNOW i should be running test with this but for my first run with test i want to be at like 8% BF and just eat farms of chickens and forest of broccoli. At this point I just feel like a fat ass. I need to shed this fat before I hit the weights and test hard.


Give me that good no bullshit advice that i know you guys are good for...

 

[Liftbig11]

If you feel like a fat ass then drop the var do an ECA stack I guess but that is going to send your bp through the roof. Diet is the only thing that you can do for now that will make you shed the pounds. No gear will do that for you without the diet.

 

[MS1605]

If you feel like a fat ass then drop the var do an ECA stack I guess but that is going to send your bp through the roof. Diet is the only thing that you can do for now that will make you shed the pounds. No gear will do that for you without the diet.

Why would I diet without the Var when I can Diet with the Var? Honest question, not trying to be a smart ass?

My problem is I always get about 20 LBS into losing, hit a road block (not due to diet), quit losing and I get all pissed.

The combination of hitting the wall and on top of that my strength being lower due to the lower cals makes me start eating everything I can get my hands on and lifting as heavy as possible. then I put the weight right back on.

I know it sounds fucking ridiculous by this is what I have been dealing with for 5+ years now. Same fucking thing over and over. I cant get over this hump.

Like I said, im 225 now and over the last 5 years I have EASILY dropped to around 200 but then i hit that wall and it goes downhill from there.

I was hoping the Var would put me over that hump.

To be honest after 5 years of this bullshit if I got down to 185 i would never put another piece of junk food in my mouth again...

I HAVE to get past this 200 mark.


Sorry for the long rant. This shit is just getting old on me.

 

[Massive123]

Bro you need test in there. Enanthate or cypionate is best for you. It will help you get where you want to be. Var only is so mild you might think whatever results you get is from the var but diet & cardio will really be what makes or breaks you. The test will aid in this tremendously. Ask MGunz about a var only cycle. You will waste the var & end up doing test when you realize what's up anyway

 

[R1rider]

I think if you lift hard and do enough cardio, you can eat anything you like. It works for me. I would def add test to that cycle. You dont realy have to go to 1500cals. Eat a proper diet and train hard.

 

[robbocopp]

So what's the problem with just var and good diet ? none...

yeah you can add test -- it will be nicer gains -- probably reasonable boost in metabolism ..

but for losing weight -- var with a good diet will work -- I would definitely do some post cycle therapy (pct) though - don't know if you 'll need HCG but tamoxifen for sure (better exemestane).

ps. if you have reached a plateau of losing weight - check your thyroid levels - and then stick T3 in there 2x/day starting with 25mcg each time up to 50mcgs/each time.

 

[cyto33]

If you feel like a fat ass then drop the var do an ECA stack I guess but that is going to send your bp through the roof. Diet is the only thing that you can do for now that will make you shed the pounds. No gear will do that for you without the diet.

the var is not the answer. drop the var use a good diet and just use the ECA. keep a check on the Blood Pressure and heart palpations.

 

[MS1605]

Thanks for all the great advice guys. the one conflicting matter I have when I bring this up is this:

Im told that with my BF, Around 18%, I should get down to where my abs are visible, blah blah blah(you know the line.) Before I juice. Which is fine. thats actually what I want. I want to get shredded so I can see all the little progress im making while im on cycle.

THEN...

Im told to use Var AND Test to drop the weight.

Well if the reason im looking to drop the weight in the first place is to run my first decent cycle of gear, why would i run Var and Test to drop the weight? its contradicting...

Guess I have more contemplating to do.

 

[cyto33]

Var will help make the muscle harden up and give you that paper skin look but it won't cut fat. no steroid will. what the idea behind test and var is, you take them and adjust your diet to low calorie intake and work your ass off to cut UP meaning you build muscle from the fat deposits you burn. you may stay the same weight but it will be muscle not fat. and it will look more cut.

 

[MS1605]

Thanks for the input Cyto.

Looks like its test and Var.

So on a cutting cycle, should I still stick to the tried and true first cycle of:

Test E 250 mg 2x week x 12 weeks
Var 50MG ED x 8W

I have read that you want to stay around 8 weeks for the Var, if so should i start the var and test at the same time or stager them?


Last but not least, can I take my beloved ECA stack with the test and var? When im on this shit i can eat a measly 1k cals a day and still feel amazing. So hopefully I can run that as well.

Thanks again for all the insight. I dont know what im more nervous about. Pinning for the first time or ordering the shit for the first time...

 

[jackt]

I'm curious, what exactly does your diet look like when you say you're putting all that fat on?? I just don't see how gaining that much fat is possible with a flawless diet and training regimen regardless if you're bulking or not.

 

[cyto33]

lets look at your diet as well. i agree with jackt we should at least see what you have going on there. around 2500-3000cal a day should help you drop fat.
As for using ECA i would not use it while running the cycle cuase of the BP increase. use the ECA after and do cardio with it for half hour a day.

start the var on the 4th week and run it to the end. then 2 weeks after last pin start pct.

 

[Liftbig11]

Still think you should drop all gear and do ECA alone. Perfect diet and ECA will give you the results you are looking for. Would also add in cardio 40 mins a day. Thats just my opinion but each his own.

 

[MS1605]

Diet all depends on what im doing. when im trying to cut (every time I have hit the 200 wall and given up like a pussy) Im on ECA, taking in about 1500 cals.

diet consisting of oatmeal, eggs, chicken breast, tuna, salmon, raw almonds, steak, sweet potatoes, broccoli, spinach, brown rice.


That list is like 95% complete. im sure i missed one or 2 things but its pretty damn accurate.

When Im not cutting and just lifting my ass off and attending the MMA gym twice a week, i throw a lot of that out the window.

I usually eat a lot of pasta (im Italian what do you want from me ? ) Steak, Potatoes, oatmeal, tuna with mayo, and of course some form of junk food about once a day(beer, mmm.)

One thing I drink regardless of the time is skim milk. My house with My Fiancee, Son And me will go through a Gallon of milk a day. No eggageration. Maybe even 1 and a half. I dont know how good that is since milk has a lot of extra cals but I LOVE a glass of ice cold milk whenever I can.

On another note, I quit drinking pop and juice when I was a sophmore in HS. So it has been a LOOOONG time since any of that.

Besides that everything is pretty straight forward.

Thats the thing that's weird with me. When I cut, im so focused its rediculious. I will go 3 months easily without touching one thing that will have a negative impact on my diet. Then as soon as I hit that wall its over. There is no in between. its either all or nothing. I wish I could change that because 80% at 60% of the time is better then 100% only 40% of the time. If you get what im getting at.

 

[Liftbig11]

Seems like you answered your own problem. Stop being a pussy problem solved. Sounds like you are a quiter to me. Step it up and keep it up. Everything takes time and will all come together as you want it.

 

[MS1605]

Seems like you answered your own problem. Stop being a pussy problem solved. Sounds like you are a quiter to me. Step it up and keep it up. Everything takes time and will all come together as you want it.

I think Maybe I will take a more direct approach to solving the problem and find out why I hit the wall at 200lbs.

Started the ECA today, if everything goes the same way it did in the past, It will take about 2 months to get down to 200.

Anyone give me some input on what to take for things like thyroid as mentioned by Robbo.

Also, I have a shit load of OTC stuff on hand that may aid me. I know this is a forum for real gear but maybe some of you have some input on OTC shit.

I have 3 bottles of 1-t Tren, I bottle of Lean FX (cort blocker), 3 bottles of 11-OXO, Couple bottles of epistane, and the list goes on.

Is there any reason to add something like the 11-OXO when im down to around 200 and my bodies all fucked up?


Thanks again for all the honest answers. I fuckin love you guys.

 

[Liftbig11]

No problem bro. Just a little harsh cause we want to drive you in the right direction. If you want I would do an epi cycle once your down to about 200. If it's your first you can do 30 mg everyday for 6 weeks then get some nolva or clomid for pct.

 

[Teutonic]

you are doing mma..great. And using it to burn fat as an aerobic..Awesome.
I would not starve myself with 1500 calories..I would do some cardio..4-6 days a week, in the morning on an empty stomach..
That will drive your metabolism for the rest of the day... eat more..good food...as you are doing.
All the best...bro Test/var when your ready..it ll help retain muscle..especially when when you cut cal s seriously..but it ain t majic..diet and cardio are.

 

[MS1605]

No problem bro. Just a little harsh cause we want to drive you in the right direction. If you want I would do an epi cycle once your down to about 200. If it's your first you can do 30 mg everyday for 6 weeks then get some nolva or clomid for pct.

I tried doing epi, PP 1-t and ECA about 5 months ago. On 1500cals I blew the fuck up. I don't know what it was because i wasn't eating enough to put on what i did. But I went from 215 to 240, swear to god. im assuming it was all water. i was drinking at least 1.5 gallons a day. But i looked horrible...

I may try to do it once more with out the 1-t. I also have some lean FX (cort blocker) and some 11-oxo as stated earlier. ...

you are doing mma..great. And using it to burn fat as an aerobic..Awesome.
I would not starve myself with 1500 calories..I would do some cardio..4-6 days a week, in the morning on an empty stomach..
That will drive your metabolism for the rest of the day... eat more..good food...as you are doing.
All the best...bro Test/var when your ready..it ll help retain muscle..especially when when you cut cal s seriously..but it ain t majic..diet and cardio are.

How long for the cardio and what intensity on the empty stomach? Im assuming that i could take some BCAAs to stay out of the catabolic state.

 

[JMC]

you are doing mma..great. And using it to burn fat as an aerobic..Awesome.
I would not starve myself with 1500 calories..I would do some cardio..4-6 days a week, in the morning on an empty stomach..
That will drive your metabolism for the rest of the day... eat more..good food...as you are doing.
All the best...bro Test/var when your ready..it ll help retain muscle..especially when when you cut cal s seriously..but it ain t majic..diet and cardio are.

I agree w/ German

Are you eating every 3 hrs????