I am just starting my first week of trt and my doc prescribed 200 mg a wk of test cyp and 200 ius a day of hcg. I split the test into 2 injections a wk and am thinking of doing 500ius 2 a week for hcg. I was planning on asking about getting arimidex as well but was surprised to find my estrogen level at 15 which i thought was really low so i figured i would wait until next blood test to assess. I am wondering if anyone has any suggestions about how much hcg i should be taking. I thought the initial dose of 1400 ius was extreme. Any other helpful advice would be appreciated.
Ask Anything You Want about TRT Thread........
- Thread starter THE-DET-OAK
- Start date
dazed and confused?
I am just starting my first week of trt and i am on a prescribed dose of 200 mg/wk of test cyp and 200 ius of hcg a day. My blood test results were as follows: dhea-281, estradiol-14.2(pg/ml) HSBG-31, Total test-421(ng/dl), Free test8.93. I was thinking that the dose of 1400 ius a wk of hcg was a bit much but was wondering what you all think. As of now i am doing a 2 a wk injection of test and `hcg. I am doing 500 ius each injection of hcg for 1000 ius a wk. Any suggestions on hcg dosage? I was also thinking of asking my doc about starting arimidex with the trt but my estrogen was so low that i figured I would see what happens in 2 mos when i go back for second blood draw. I was wondering if that is a good idea to wait that long or not. I think i have had symptoms of low estrogen for about 6 mos because my joints have been extremely achy. Was also wondering if it is normal for estrogen to be so low without taking an ai or something similar. I was surprised to see it so low. Last question is at what levels of hematocrit should you go and donate blood. Also would be interested in any other advice for a newb.
I am just starting my first week of trt and i am on a prescribed dose of 200 mg/wk of test cyp and 200 ius of hcg a day. My blood test results were as follows: dhea-281, estradiol-14.2(pg/ml) HSBG-31, Total test-421(ng/dl), Free test8.93. I was thinking that the dose of 1400 ius a wk of hcg was a bit much but was wondering what you all think. As of now i am doing a 2 a wk injection of test and `hcg. I am doing 500 ius each injection of hcg for 1000 ius a wk. Any suggestions on hcg dosage? I was also thinking of asking my doc about starting arimidex with the trt but my estrogen was so low that i figured I would see what happens in 2 mos when i go back for second blood draw. I was wondering if that is a good idea to wait that long or not. I think i have had symptoms of low estrogen for about 6 mos because my joints have been extremely achy. Was also wondering if it is normal for estrogen to be so low without taking an ai or something similar. I was surprised to see it so low. Last question is at what levels of hematocrit should you go and donate blood. Also would be interested in any other advice for a newb.
Mprtz
New member
It will take some time for levels to stabilize... you say you just started TRT? Are your test levels from before? If they are from the first week of TRT I would consider them transitional and of limited usefulness.
I think daily dosing of hcg is pretty unnecessary. I think 2 weekly injections of 350iu or so would be enough IMO - about half your current weekly dosage. Nothing really wrong with 500iu twice a week either.
I think that on 200mg per week it is pretty likely that you will need an AI, but in your situation waiting until the first valid blood test (4 or 6 weeks out) could be a good idea.
Hematocrit can be pretty variable. I started on 200mg per week and my HCT went from 46 to 53 in the space of a few months. Hard to predict how much of an issue it will be for you personally. It makes some sense to start the process early to make sure you are eligible so that you don't have to scramble for a backup solution if you are not.
EDIT: didn't realize I was posting in IMT's thread, sorry bout that
I think daily dosing of hcg is pretty unnecessary. I think 2 weekly injections of 350iu or so would be enough IMO - about half your current weekly dosage. Nothing really wrong with 500iu twice a week either.
I think that on 200mg per week it is pretty likely that you will need an AI, but in your situation waiting until the first valid blood test (4 or 6 weeks out) could be a good idea.
Hematocrit can be pretty variable. I started on 200mg per week and my HCT went from 46 to 53 in the space of a few months. Hard to predict how much of an issue it will be for you personally. It makes some sense to start the process early to make sure you are eligible so that you don't have to scramble for a backup solution if you are not.
EDIT: didn't realize I was posting in IMT's thread, sorry bout that
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Thank you for your response. And yes those blood test results were before i started trt. So from what i understand there is not necessarily a number on your hematocrit that flags donating your blood? And by start the process you mean find a donation site and make sure they will accept my blood?
IMT staff
Official Sponsor
Not our thread man its the communities!!
We need all the help we can get, thanks for your time!
Mprtz
New member
I would certainly consider donating when (more when than if) your HCT goes out of range, usually over 51%.
There is something to be said for keeping ahead of the curve on these things, so in your position I would donate about two months in regardless.
If you have not been a regular blood donor, they may ask you why you decided to donate now. I was asked that question and answered that I was told that my doctor-prescribed hormone treatments might make it a good idea to donate. Not everyone would agree, but I felt that honesty was the best policy for me. The screeners are not stupid and can put two and two together, I'm glad I got it out there in the beginning. It then turned out I was at 53% which might have required an explanation that would be difficult to provide had I initially stonewalled. YMMV and you should try to find about your blood center's deferment policies first.
If you don't mind my asking: how old are you? What prompted you to go on TRT and who put you on TRT at 421 ng/dL?
HI Guys,
First time posting anything here. Just got my Testosterone Blood work back and Testosterone was at 190 im seeing an endocrinologist and she only wants to give me HCG and not Testosterone she has a hard time understanding how or why they should be giving together. I was trying to tell her about what I have read and she seems kinda confused. Is there any legitimate sources I can site that I can maybe print out and take to her about giving T Injections along with HCG?
First time posting anything here. Just got my Testosterone Blood work back and Testosterone was at 190 im seeing an endocrinologist and she only wants to give me HCG and not Testosterone she has a hard time understanding how or why they should be giving together. I was trying to tell her about what I have read and she seems kinda confused. Is there any legitimate sources I can site that I can maybe print out and take to her about giving T Injections along with HCG?
THE-DET-OAK
IncreasedMyT @ ULV
This is a great article on HCG Prescribed HCG
HCG alone is ok, its called HCG mono therapy. The problem is most guys end up trying testosterone and once you do HCG is just not strong enough anymore.
The reason you want to do both is because testosterone is suppressive to the HPTA axis. Through the negative feedback loop your body reads high testosterone levels and tells the pituitary to stop sending out FSH and LH. So now your testes do not receive these two hormones. If you don't use it you lose it, that saying holds true here.
Your balls basically die, they become insensitive to LH and FSH hormones. This causes them to shrink, stop making sperm and progesterone. Most people don't realize this is the lubrication for your arteries.
This negative feedback loop also suppress other hormones in your body. Its really simple, you want to keep as many processes going as you can. Whether your on testosterone or not.
She is probably worried that you are trying to get jacked, in her mind taking HCG and testosterone together will put your testosterone levels too high and you be "doing steroids" or whatever she calls it.
Thats not true though, HCG is not very strong and adds little to the way of testosterone to the total amount in your bloodstream. When your doing TRT your just taking enough to keep them alive, not enough to keep them pumping out at high output.
Hope this makes sense.
HCG alone is ok, its called HCG mono therapy. The problem is most guys end up trying testosterone and once you do HCG is just not strong enough anymore.
The reason you want to do both is because testosterone is suppressive to the HPTA axis. Through the negative feedback loop your body reads high testosterone levels and tells the pituitary to stop sending out FSH and LH. So now your testes do not receive these two hormones. If you don't use it you lose it, that saying holds true here.
Your balls basically die, they become insensitive to LH and FSH hormones. This causes them to shrink, stop making sperm and progesterone. Most people don't realize this is the lubrication for your arteries.
This negative feedback loop also suppress other hormones in your body. Its really simple, you want to keep as many processes going as you can. Whether your on testosterone or not.
She is probably worried that you are trying to get jacked, in her mind taking HCG and testosterone together will put your testosterone levels too high and you be "doing steroids" or whatever she calls it.
Thats not true though, HCG is not very strong and adds little to the way of testosterone to the total amount in your bloodstream. When your doing TRT your just taking enough to keep them alive, not enough to keep them pumping out at high output.
Hope this makes sense.
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Milton
Administrator
you need to share more info, what sides do you have? history?
Nostalgic
New member
I'm feeling tired often, libido not as high as it used to be when I was younger. Not depressed. but not feeling that high sex drive I had.
also receding hair line (not sure if this has something to do with low test, more with DHT sensibility I believe).
hard to make gains in the gym (get muscle mass/jacked).
also receding hair line (not sure if this has something to do with low test, more with DHT sensibility I believe).
hard to make gains in the gym (get muscle mass/jacked).
appleton111
The Man with the Plan
what are your stats mate? age, weight, height. etc. can you share your complete blood test results?
Nostalgic
New member
I'm 25yo, 5'10" 170lbs 11%bf. (have difficulty putting on mass)
I only did total test exams, asked my doctor for an exam with free test,cortisol levels and total test.
Consulted with a general practician, still thinking about going to an endo if my test levels come back as low as they are.
I've seen a few reports of people who went on trt. They've said it was great, nothing but positive side effects. I don't see why I should get on it since i'm <<300 ng/dl. And I would shut down my natural production for good if I use HCG with the TRT.
I only did total test exams, asked my doctor for an exam with free test,cortisol levels and total test.
Consulted with a general practician, still thinking about going to an endo if my test levels come back as low as they are.
I've seen a few reports of people who went on trt. They've said it was great, nothing but positive side effects. I don't see why I should get on it since i'm <<300 ng/dl. And I would shut down my natural production for good if I use HCG with the TRT.
PurpleNurple
I am banned!
IMO...for whatever it is worth. Putting on mass is all about diet. From what I have seen, most men with low testosterone issues tend to have trouble getting rid of fat, not putting on mass.
I am not saying that TRT won't help you but if you eat more, you will gain weight.
Gainjin260
I am banned!
You don't have symptoms. You don't need exogenous testosterone. Sex drive decreases from 18 onwards. It's normal. People with low t generally have trouble with reducing body fat. You're 11% dude. If you can't gain muscle then you aren't eating enough.
When did you get your blood drawn? It's imperative that it's drawn first thing in the morning (btw 7-8:30 latest) or the results will be skewed.
THE-DET-OAK
IncreasedMyT @ ULV
I don't understand why people on the boards do this? "You don't need exogenous T"
How do you know that? And yea most people gain visceral fat when they have lowT but not everyone, some develop wasting and cant gain much weight no matter what.
Its not imperative that you test your TT first thing in the morning either that is a total myth. TT levels remain within 10% of peak and trough throughout the entire day.
How do you know that? And yea most people gain visceral fat when they have lowT but not everyone, some develop wasting and cant gain much weight no matter what.
Its not imperative that you test your TT first thing in the morning either that is a total myth. TT levels remain within 10% of peak and trough throughout the entire day.
Nostalgic
New member
thanks for the insight.
I was thinking these days, I don't want to live the rest of my life with low test. I really don't see any downsides to TRT. I can avoid my natural test shutdown with HCG.
Will do a few more tests and see my endo to start it.
Mprtz
New member
HCG will not keep you from being shut down, you may still produce some test but your HPTA will still be shut down at the pituitary level. You're so young, make sure you understand the consequences before committing yourself.
Batman5719
New member
Wanted to see If I could get some advise on current situation. Try and run through quick synopsis of medical history. I'm military so I move a lot which requires me to explain medical history to new doctors every couple years
2012 ran a winstrol only cycle for 5 months and shut myself down and no PCT. Symptoms after use blood coming out of nipples and painful lumps (GYNO) exhausted, depression ect
2013 PCM prescribes Viagra causes intense migrains then prescribed Cialis and works for ED
2013 Eventually get a referral to an endo who attempts to jump start my low T system with HCG for 3 months. Which seemed to help but I don't think I ever fully recovered, He did do the labs I just don't remember the exact numbers
2014 Change duty stations and state: Issues continue and I have trouble getting any kind of care.
2014 APRIL 07 PCM does labs and refers me to urology.
PORTION OF THE LAB FROM PCM
Testosterone Free 8.1 Lower Than Normal pg/mL (30.0-135.0)
Testosterone 400.6 ng/dL (348.0-1197.0)
Follitropin 2.2 mIU/mL 1.5-12.4
Lutropin 2.4 mIU/mL 1.7-8.6
2014OCT11- Urologist says labs were a fluke does another lab says I am not a candidate for TRT
Testosterone 670.00 ng/dL (280.00-800.00)
2015-2016 issues continue PCM does another lab
Testosterone 603 ng/dL 348-1197
Testosterone Free 13.9 pg/mL 9.3-26.5
2017 get another referral to urology at new duty station lab performed:
Testosterone 311.50 ng/dL (280.00-800.00)
Sex Hormone Binding Globulin 35.0 nmol/L 16.5-55.9
Prolactin 8.050 ng/mL (4.040-15.200)
Lutropin 4.330 mIU/mL
So the current Urologist said I am on the low normal side. He will start me on testosterone if I would like however since I am considering having another child in the next year he recommended trying 6 weeks on clomid and then doing more lab work. Just curious based off some of the lab work ect what your opinions are. Since this has been several doctors over the years I have posted the lab work that those gentlemen did and that I could still get my hands on. Obviously some of the doctors check more in depth then others. I work out 5 days a week and eat healthy. I do not drink alcohol or smoke and I am 31 years old. I'm thinking the disproportional lab work may be contributed to the time of day I took the labs? What are your recommendations?
2012 ran a winstrol only cycle for 5 months and shut myself down and no PCT. Symptoms after use blood coming out of nipples and painful lumps (GYNO) exhausted, depression ect
2013 PCM prescribes Viagra causes intense migrains then prescribed Cialis and works for ED
2013 Eventually get a referral to an endo who attempts to jump start my low T system with HCG for 3 months. Which seemed to help but I don't think I ever fully recovered, He did do the labs I just don't remember the exact numbers
2014 Change duty stations and state: Issues continue and I have trouble getting any kind of care.
2014 APRIL 07 PCM does labs and refers me to urology.
PORTION OF THE LAB FROM PCM
Testosterone Free 8.1 Lower Than Normal pg/mL (30.0-135.0)
Testosterone 400.6 ng/dL (348.0-1197.0)
Follitropin 2.2 mIU/mL 1.5-12.4
Lutropin 2.4 mIU/mL 1.7-8.6
2014OCT11- Urologist says labs were a fluke does another lab says I am not a candidate for TRT
Testosterone 670.00 ng/dL (280.00-800.00)
2015-2016 issues continue PCM does another lab
Testosterone 603 ng/dL 348-1197
Testosterone Free 13.9 pg/mL 9.3-26.5
2017 get another referral to urology at new duty station lab performed:
Testosterone 311.50 ng/dL (280.00-800.00)
Sex Hormone Binding Globulin 35.0 nmol/L 16.5-55.9
Prolactin 8.050 ng/mL (4.040-15.200)
Lutropin 4.330 mIU/mL
So the current Urologist said I am on the low normal side. He will start me on testosterone if I would like however since I am considering having another child in the next year he recommended trying 6 weeks on clomid and then doing more lab work. Just curious based off some of the lab work ect what your opinions are. Since this has been several doctors over the years I have posted the lab work that those gentlemen did and that I could still get my hands on. Obviously some of the doctors check more in depth then others. I work out 5 days a week and eat healthy. I do not drink alcohol or smoke and I am 31 years old. I'm thinking the disproportional lab work may be contributed to the time of day I took the labs? What are your recommendations?
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