Calves in general

[Tombraider]

One of the most stubborn muscles to grow (If youre not already genetically blessed). Im sure we have all heard the many theories on how to create massive calves...

from super sets, to failure, to training heavy on gastroc with low reps and light on soleus with high reps, to how wether they should be trained twice a week thrice a week... etc??

Im not an expert on this so im asking you guys out there for help on this!!! I know the anatomy of the calve muscle needs to be taken into consideration before deciding how it should be trained in order for it to grow

I suffered a bad ankle injury and months later im trying to get them to grow back, bigger and better! Im on a var cycle now and hoping this will aid in some growth. ANY ADVISE WOULD BE APPRECIATED!

 

[cashout]

Over the years as I've watched people who have no calves train them, I've noticed a couple of consistent trends. The biggest mistake I see is- poor range of motion.

Most people tend to bounce or bob up and down on their toes and think they are working their calves.

You need a full range of motion - full stretch at the bottom and up on the tips of your big toes as high as you can get on every rep.

I also suggest train them in with same rep ranges that work best for your other body parts. If your chest grows with 10 reps, your calves will too.

Finally, 2X a week all out heavy is what has produced results for me.

 

[hard2gain]

Holy shit cashout! Those are prolly the baddest ass calves I've ever seen. I will be training mine 2x a week all out heavy from now on lol

 

[Tombraider]

Wow!! Looking awesome!! Whats your take on the whole toes pointed in, toes pointed out theory? Im not such a firm believer! And should gastroc and soleous be trained different days for optimum results?? How many rest days in between? sorry for so many question im just keen you know the feeling

You made a very good point about the range of motion though...

 

[cashout]

Wow!! Looking awesome!! Whats your take on the whole toes pointed in, toes pointed out theory? Im not such a firm believer! And should gastroc and soleous be trained different days for optimum results?? How many rest days in between? sorry for so many question im just keen you know the feeling

You made a very good point about the range of motion though...

Never used toes in/out for myself. I tell folks to stand in a relax position. Walk forward 5 steps and look down at your feet. The position your toes are pointing is the "natural" position for you and you should train with your toes just like that - the take home message is "work with your body's natural inclination not against it."

Gastroc and Soleous same day same training session. I wouldn't do upper and lower chest on different days - I treat calves any differently.

Monday and Thursday worked well for me in the beginning of my training days. I would hit them at the beginning of my workout before I started my major body part for that day. This way I couldn't slack on them or skip them b/c I was short on time.

As a side note, I think it is critically important for women to work hard to develop good calves. It adds so much to the shape and symmetry of the leg for a women if she has a nice round fully developed set of calves to compliment quads and hamstrings.

 

[MeatHead96]

Shit those calves look jacked as fuck. I'll be training my calves this way now too. They have always been a weak part for me as well. My arms are bigger than my calves.

 

[wutangnomo1]

Looking good Cashout!

I think a mistake people usually make with calves is they go waaayyyy too heavy. I have found reducing the weight drastically has helped me hit my calves better.

 

[DaHurt]

I hit them hard and heavy twice a week also. I'll either train them before the major part for the day, or come in later that evening for a separate calves-only session. I've put between 1-1.5 inches on them training this way since September.

I usually always do donkey and seated raises (as heavy as possible - failure at 8-12 reps), then either leg press calf extension drop-sets to failure or standing raises.

I also make sure to hold the bottom of each rep (extension) for at least a two-count, and the same with the top (contraction). I always imagine trying to standing on the tip of my big toe like a ballerina (hey laugh all you want, it works!).

 

[Phatbastard]

Over the years as I've watched people who have no calves train them, I've noticed a couple of consistent trends. The biggest mistake I see is- poor range of motion.

Most people tend to bounce or bob up and down on their toes and think they are working their calves.

You need a full range of motion - full stretch at the bottom and up on the tips of your big toes as high as you can get on every rep.

I also suggest train them in with same rep ranges that work best for your other body parts. If your chest grows with 10 reps, your calves will too.

Finally, 2X a week all out heavy is what has produced results for me.

More great advice Cash!

Now can we work on the tan? And those damn shorts again really? LOL

I hit them hard and heavy twice a week also. I'll either train them before the major part for the day, or come in later that evening for a separate calves-only session. I've put between 1-1.5 inches on them training this way since September.

I usually always do donkey and seated raises (as heavy as possible - failure at 8-12 reps), then either leg press calf extension drop-sets to failure or standing raises.

I also make sure to hold the bottom of each rep (extension) for at least a two-count, and the same with the top (contraction). I always imagine trying to standing on the tip of my big toe like a ballerina (hey laugh all you want, it works!).

Like a Ballerina WTF

More like

Matt Hughes stand on his tippy toes trying to intimidate Anderson Silva!

I better not see a Too Too in your next AVI or your going down!

 

[cashout]

More great advice Cash!

Now can we work on the tan? And those damn shorts again really? LOL



Like a Ballerina WTF

More like

Matt Hughes stand on his tippy toes trying to intimidate Anderson Silva!

I better not see a Too Too in your next AVI or your going down!

Shorts - I train at home in my own gym so I basicly train in the buff....

It's March who has a tan? My pool still has the cover on it...

 

[BigPal]

Cashout with some great advice again !!!!

So you think 10 rep range is more effective for growth on most muscles ?

 

[cashout]

Cashout with some great advice again !!!!

So you think 10 rep range is more effective for growth on most muscles ?

Yes - if your goal is muscle growth.

My training philosophy is simple...

Looks are more important than lifts.

You have to show people how much you can lift. They can see for themselves how good you look.

I am a bodybuilder in the purest since. I don't care about how much I can lift.

There are a lot of guys that can bench 405 and don't have half the chest I do. I can't do 405 but my chest is thick and full and round and theirs is flat and droopy.

The question comes down to what are the goals. Mine have nothing to do with lifting weights.

When it comes to muscle grow, guys have a bad habit of letting their egos get in the way of proper training for growth.

Way too many guys go for "personal lift records" and focus on doing sets of 2, 4, and 6 reps in which they are not feeling the muscle but rather focusing on getting the weight up.

Body building is about creating size, symmetry, proportion, and aesthetics. Nowhere in there is there anything about how much weight you lift.

For the overwhelming majority of guys, those things mentioned above are not well-facilitated through power lifting type of training that focuses on lifting rather than training the muscle.

The other facet of this discussion is the huge risk of getting injured doing these "lifting the weight" type of workouts as opposed to properly training the muscle. I've done this for 27 years without an injury. Read that again - that is 100% correct. I don't have any knee or shoulder issues like most guys complain about. I am 100% functional just like I was 20 years ago. Sure, you can get away with that power lifting type of training for a shot time but you are eventually going to injure yourself.

Of course, somebody is going to say Ronnie Coleman trained like a power lifter and he was the greatest ever....RIGHT....and look at him now, several spine fusions, nerve damage, torn muscles...and lastly, he is one person out of millions and millions...


So, my training is focused on...

1 - Optimizing my health
2 - Maintaining the highest quality of life
3 - Looking good (i.e. to me that is like a body builder getting ready for a show)

 

[KO'd]

I like your philosophy alot, I think I gonna start changing the way I view my training. thanks, great post.

 

[BigPal]

So based on your philosophy, how do you know when its time to go up in weight ?

And how many sets you talking at 10 reps?

 

[DaHurt]

More great advice Cash!

Now can we work on the tan? And those damn shorts again really? LOL



Like a Ballerina WTF

More like

Matt Hughes stand on his tippy toes trying to intimidate Anderson Silva!

I better not see a Too Too in your next AVI or your going down!

Haha I stick to my original statement, sir. Have you ever seen a ballerina's calves? Teeny tiny girls all with GREAT calves. AND why? FULL contraction of the muscle and holding at the peak of the contraction.

 

[DaHurt]

Yes - if your goal is muscle growth.

My training philosophy is simple...

Looks are more important than lifts.

You have to show people how much you can lift. They can see for themselves how good you look.

I am a bodybuilder in the purest since. I don't care about how much I can lift.

There are a lot of guys that can bench 405 and don't have half the chest I do. I can't do 405 but my chest is thick and full and round and theirs is flat and droopy.

The question comes down to what are the goals. Mine have nothing to do with lifting weights.

When it comes to muscle grow, guys have a bad habit of letting their egos get in the way of proper training for growth.

Way too many guys go for "personal lift records" and focus on doing sets of 2, 4, and 6 reps in which they are not feeling the muscle but rather focusing on getting the weight up.

Body building is about creating size, symmetry, proportion, and aesthetics. Nowhere in there is there anything about how much weight you lift.

For the overwhelming majority of guys, those things mentioned above are not well-facilitated through power lifting type of training that focuses on lifting rather than training the muscle.

The other facet of this discussion is the huge risk of getting injured doing these "lifting the weight" type of workouts as opposed to properly training the muscle. I've done this for 27 years without an injury. Read that again - that is 100% correct. I don't have any knee or shoulder issues like most guys complain about. I am 100% functional just like I was 20 years ago. Sure, you can get away with that power lifting type of training for a shot time but you are eventually going to injure yourself.

Of course, somebody is going to say Ronnie Coleman trained like a power lifter and he was the greatest ever....RIGHT....and look at him now, several spine fusions, nerve damage, torn muscles...and lastly, he is one person out of millions and millions...


So, my training is focused on...

1 - Optimizing my health
2 - Maintaining the highest quality of life
3 - Looking good (i.e. to me that is like a body builder getting ready for a show)

Great post, and very true.

 

[cashout]

So based on your philosophy, how do you know when its time to go up in weight ?

And how many sets you talking at 10 reps?

I don't focus on "going up in weight" and I don't have a prescribed number of sets.

It is all about how the muscle being trained feels and responds to the work.

This is where most guys problem with "how much weight am I lifting" becomes very obvious.

Most guys go into a workout with the idea already in their head that if they use X amount of weight and do X sets for X reps that is a "good" workout.

By approaching training like that all you are doing is conditioning yourself to fail at the prescribed weight and reps you have already decided is a "good" workout.

So, for me, it is not about "going up in weight" because it is a continuous process of using heavier or lighter weights with different techniques like drop sets and super sets combined with straight sets.

Again, how much weight you use is irrelevant. What matters is how well the muscle gets trained.

 

[Tombraider]

LOL @Phatbastard trying to irritate everybody and failing.

So heres another question since there are so many myths around training calves- Do we absolutly slaughter them? Since they are smaller muscles is this smart?
Or if we do them twice a week like you said- should we train them till they burn enough to feel like we've worked them?

Ive also heard that if you train calves before another muscle group, blood will flow from the calve into the working muscle and your calve would not have gotten a sufficient amount of time holding the pump (bloodflow).
Whats your take on this? Hence why I try to train calves alone, If I cant i train them with Abs or after my other muscle groups that dont have a problem growing.

 

[BigPal]

Your philosophy is very similar to how I was trained over 16 years ago. But throughout the years I too have ran into lots of guys with ego issues who make you doubt you know what your talkin about.

Ok, maybe a better question instead of how many sets would be, how long are your workouts ?

I break my muscles up into days individually. Chest Mondays, Back, Arms, shoulders, abs, then legs. Sunday is rest day.

I would go and do 1 and 1/2 hours to 2 hrs everyday for each muscle. But many guys were telling me I was "overtraining"

I just feel like when I do 45 mins it just doesnt feel thorough enough...

whats your thoughts?

 

[BigPal]

LOL @Phatbastard trying to irritate everybody and failing.

So heres another question since there are so many myths around training calves- Do we absolutly slaughter them? Since they are smaller muscles is this smart?
Or if we do them twice a week like you said- should we train them till they burn enough to feel like we've worked them?

Ive also heard that if you train calves before another muscle group, blood will flow from the calve into the working muscle and your calve would not have gotten a sufficient amount of time holding the pump (bloodflow).
Whats your take on this? Hence why I try to train calves alone, If I cant i train them with Abs or after my other muscle groups that dont have a problem growing.

Bro you dont need a pump to know youve trained that muscle good. What hes saying is use proper technique, full range of motion, slow and controlled. I always start with a super low weight just to feel what the "full range of motion" is. If your not getting that full range when you increase the weight than you are not training that muscle correctly.