Tren . What do you guys personally notice/get from it

[THE-DET-OAK]

Some say Tren increases prostaglandin levels, like a female during menstruation you may become dehydrated

 

[halfwit]

Okay, trying to squeeze in some research before dinner. To the reason why tren doesn't aromatize:

Trenbolone itself is a synthetic derivative of Nandrolone, meaning it is a modification of Nandrolone. This also means that Trenbolone is classified as a 19-nor compound, meaning it lacks the 19th carbon that is typically held by Testosterone and all other anabolic steroids (except for Nandrolone). Both Nandrolone and Trenbolone do not possess this 19th carbon, and they are therefore classified as 19-nor compounds. This also results in Trenbolone and Nandrolone being categorized as Progestins, meaning they exhibit Progestogenic activity within the body, and will exhibit varying degrees of interaction with the Progestosterone receptor.

...

1. A significantly larger affinity for the androgen receptor is created, resulting in Trenbolone being much more potent than its parent hormone Nandrolone[3]. Trenbolone possesses 5 times the anabolic muscle building strength than Testosterone, with Testosterone’s anabolic rating being 100 and Trenbolone’s anabolic rating being 500.

2. Trenbolone becomes completely resistant to aromatization (the conversion into Estrogen), as the aromatase enzyme (the enzyme responsible for aromatization) cannot recognize Trenbolone as an appropriate substrate for chemical reaction[4]. This is different from Nandrolone, which is merely more resistant to aromatization than Testosterone, rather than completely immune to it like Trenbolone is.

3. A very high resistance to metabolism in the body. These modifications allow Trenbolone to linger around in its active form longer than most other anabolic steroids, and this is also evident by the fact that the majority of Trenbolone excreted in the urine is in its original format rather than a greater amount being excreted as metabolites. This also owes to its greater anabolic effect.

This is pretty much what I remembered reading awhile ago, but I like the way it's explained here, and I had wondered about "Tren piss" - which this does put into a great context that makes intuitive sense.

*Note*: I am only quoting a specific site as they contain the references at the bottom of the page, and I didn't want to diminish from the author's body of work. I realize that off-site links are typically frowned upon, however I do not believe this to be a competitor to ology. It appears to be filtered regardless, but I don't want to give the impression that I'm attempting to circumvent rules.

With regards to the ECLIA interference, I'm going to ask for forgiveness as this is a bit lazy on my part - but I do have a six year old seriously contending for my attention this evening. Here is a fantastic post, with the appropriate references at the bottom. I prefer to find my own, but as this is somewhat intuitive, I hope it doesn't reduce the credibility too greatly.

Tren, Estradiol and Labcorp, Roche ECLIA blood work, Bilirubin bloodwork
The Roche ECLIA assay starts by introducing antibodies that are designed to bind specifically to the what’s being tested for (in this case estradiol). The antigen also has a ruthenium molecule attached to it that can emit light with electrical current (through electron excitation). The amount of light that is emitted later reveals the concentration of the compound being tested for such that the more light detected, the lower the concentration. But here’s where tren causes problems…

While the antibodies are very specific to estradiol in this particular test, there is cross-reactivity and roughly 0.1% will bind to trenbolone. Doesn’t sound like much, but trenbolone’s structure reduces the excitability of the ruthenium complex from before, meaning it takes more electricity (and thus electrons flowing through) to generate any light. Remember, the less light emitted, the higher the concentration of E2 is thought to exist with this method.

Next, these tiny magnetic beads that are coated with a streptavidin protein are added to the blood. These beads bind to the estradiol and some of the tren that already attached to the first antibody added (with the ruthenium that emits light under electrical current).

Now before the electricity flows to detect light, another compound is introduced in a known quantity. in this case, it is more estradiol that has already been “biotinylated” (estradiol with a vitamin b7 attached to it). Biotin and streptavidin are extremely attracted to each other, so this new estradiol (that will not emit light) competes with the existing estradiol to bind to the magnetic beads. The idea is that the more estradiol that was already in the blood, the more of this new labeled estradiol gets competed off and because this alters the total light emission, you can extrapolate how much estradiol was in the sample originally.

Unfortunately, the tren doesn’t ever lose its fight to keep its little microbead against the biotinylated estradiol because tren is king. And as reactions continue, more and more tren ends up swooping in and dominating like the alpha that it is.

Finally, a magnetic plate pulls all of the compounds that matter out of the solution, and the rest of the blood is washed away, including your true estradiol levels.

How ECLIA works.

If you need to know your true estradiol levels while running trenbolone, you should request the estradiol sensitive assay.

The source of this write-up can be found here. Again, not trying to post links to other forums, but this is also edited by the forums - I just want to show my due diligence in being up front that the work is not my own. (Yeah, Universities today REALLY drive that anti-plagairism stuff hard!)

So with all that information, I still don't understand if or how trenbolone can interfere with the 5a reductase process that occurs to cleave testosterone into DHT. Yes, it binds very strongly, and yes, it does react with a form of estradiol, but I don't think we can really draw a meaningful conclusion from this.

 

[Megatron28]

Want to send me the links and I will see if I am able to insert them?

 

[halfwit]

Want to send me the links and I will see if I am able to insert them?

Oh, I know how to circumvent the filter, but I don't want to break rules - unless these are considered okay sites for this purpose. Pm sent.

 

[Megatron28]

Here are Halfwit's links.

https://www. steroidal. com/steroid-profiles/parabolan/

https://m. reddit. com/r/steroids/wiki/trenbolone


Take out the spaces I inserted to get to the sites.

 

[DinoTexas]

I don't know what the fuck you guys are talking about anymore; but I'll give you all credit for being very well studied. I know this, I am a monster on Tren unlike any other compound. I'm beginning to understand the downside a bit better after 6 weeks, as I type this its 3:15am and I'm sweating like I just stole a TV. But full, dry, and lean as hell. I don't know how it does this so quickly. 3-4 months I can wrap my head around, but week 4-5 felt as though I looked after a four month test blast. UnrealView attachment 564568

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

Oh, I know how to circumvent the filter, but I don't want to break rules - unless these are considered okay sites for this purpose. Pm sent.

I agree with almost all of your recent post, I don't think Tren aromatizes. I actually think it just behaves like an estrogen, but even stronger so that might be why it shows up on the labs.

Do you guys see this happening with any other compound or just Tren and Nandrolone? Referring to it showing as E on a non sensitive.

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

In the study I posted on cattle you will see that only the TBA (trenbelone acetate) + Estrogen effected IGF-1 readings.

We also now know that we need estrogen to build muscle and burn fat, so my question would be how do Tren only cycles work for guys if it isn't playing the role of estrogen?

 

[halfwit]

In the study I posted on cattle you will see that only the TBA (trenbelone acetate) + Estrogen effected IGF-1 readings.

We also now know that we need estrogen to build muscle and burn fat, so my question would be how do Tren only cycles work for guys if it isn't playing the role of estrogen?

They really don't work that well. Test is the base of every cycle - and for a good reason. I suspect that the lingering estradiol in the system lasts long enough to see some results, but after that, it's quite lackluster compared to doing it properly.

I suspect a great deal of tren's magic comes from insulin manipulation. I haven't found anything concrete online, but as someone that manages their blood glucose pretty strictly - I do become a bit more insulin sensitive on tren. I postulate that this may have something to do with the nutrient partitioning capabilities, and why it's such a powerful recomping drug.

Sadly almost all the studies on parabolan from the 60's and 70's when it was first introduced have mostly faded away. Occasionally I'll find something on finaject (for human consumption), but it's usually just patient literature.

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

They really don't work that well.

You'd be surprised. I know guys that have done it and they are huge. So we may have to disagree a tad there Thats ok though this is what I wanted, discussion.

In other news this thread is gonna crack 2k views today woo hoo

 

[halfwit]

You'd be surprised. I know guys that have done it and they are huge. So we may have to disagree a tad there Thats ok though this is what I wanted, discussion.

In other news this thread is gonna crack 2k views today woo hoo

Being huge doesn't mean they're doing it right. I remember the old school way of cycling, and while dbol only cycles and using nolva as an "AI" with zinc did get some results - it's just not in the same ballpark as to what we can achieve today.

But we can agree to disagree if you'd like.

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

I just know that it raises IGF-1 on labs. Even on Tren only, so thats where I get lost. Is something happening different with humans than cattle?

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

I also know that DHT rates go down on Tren and on Testosterone they go up.

My point is that why do guys have a strong sex drive on Tren only if it doesn't convert to DHT? Since we know it doesn't how else can we explain the limp noodles after cessation of Trenbolone? Even after TT levels have somewhat returned to normal.

 

[Southernfish]

In the study I posted on cattle you will see that only the TBA (trenbelone acetate) + Estrogen effected IGF-1 readings.

We also now know that we need estrogen to build muscle and burn fat, so my question would be how do Tren only cycles work for guys if it isn't playing the role of estrogen?

By Tren only cycles 'working' I assume you mean building muscle and getting lean? And just for the record (for any new guys reading this) I would never recommend a cycle without Testosterone as a base.

Whether or not estrogen, DHT, and Ill even go so far as to say Testosterone, are presesnt, we cant ignore the fact of Trens great ability to increase IGF1 and the increased feed efficiency which it provides (both of these causing growth). And due to its strong affinity to bind to the androgen receptor we are going to see some fat loss.

 

[Southernfish]

I also know that DHT rates go down on Tren and on Testosterone they go up.

My point is that why do guys have a strong sex drive on Tren only if it doesn't convert to DHT? Since we know it doesn't how else can we explain the limp noodles after cessation of Trenbolone? Even after TT levels have somewhat returned to normal.

I think a lot of these random things that happen to people cant be scientifically explained/argued for, or against. I think someones genetic make up has a lot to do with the peculiar things that can sometimes happen......eg:

Some guys get 'Deca dick' when running Nandrolone and need a DA to get things back in order. Some guys can run all the Nandrolone they want and no issues at all. Same goes for Trenbolone. Some guys' libido goes down the toilet, and some guys' libido shoots through the roof even if the individuals are doing the exact same thing drug/ancillary wise.

Some guys' libido is shot when e2 gets too high, some guys' libido is fine when this happen. And same goes for when e2 levels drop too low.

Some guys can run all the AIs and SERMs they want and still get gyno but, another guy can be running the same dose or cocktail of drugs and never see even the slightest sign of gyno.

Random examples, I know, but, even if a piece of scientific evidence says one thing does not mean this holds true 100% of the time for every individual. I am all for science. I am also all for not saying all things are firm facts for everyone. Just like how DHT does increase sex drive but, does having low DHT levels or no DHT to be seen mean libido is shot?.........maybe.....maybe not.

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

By Tren only cycles 'working' I assume you mean building muscle and getting lean? And just for the record (for any new guys reading this) I would never recommend a cycle without Testosterone as a base.

Whether or not estrogen, DHT, and Ill even go so far as to say Testosterone, are presesnt, we cant ignore the fact of Trens great ability to increase IGF1 and the increased feed efficiency which it provides (both of these causing growth). And due to its strong affinity to bind to the androgen receptor we are going to see some fat loss.

I agree, but if you look at literature on cattle TBA only pellets did not increase IGF-1, only when estrogen was added.

So my question is why does it in humans?

I hypothesize that we probably have different forms of estrogen than cattle, in our body and Tren mimics or rather competes with one of our 4 estrogens so we do not need to add estrogen.

Tren pound for pound has less effects on HCT than testosterone.

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

I also hypothesize that Tren has no effect on PRL and that guys who have those issues must also have an aromatizing compound in their body.

 

[THE-DET-OAK]

2k!!! Thar she blows!

 

[Southernfish]

2k!!! Thar she blows!

I see your sneeky advertizing tactics now

 

[Dreaded Pirate Roberts]

I also hypothesize that Tren has no effect on PRL and that guys who have those issues must also have an aromatizing compound in their body.

I don't agree. Most of the magic is tied the androgens and the elevated thyroid functions. I've seen the elevated side for progesterone when no other compound were present. Its long been my hypothesis that to experience elevator progesterone you had to have elevated estrogen. For the first 10 years around here progesterone was avoided by blocking the estrogen. It was done very effectively or so we thought. times were different we have access to lab test that we didn't in the past.