Dispute Fonz's post cycle recovery dbol bridge

[Hulkster]

Ulter is right on the money. Guys, crashing sucks BIG TIME!!!! If you dont get depressed and demotivated during a crash then you probobly are not taking your training as serious as the rest of us. Sure the dboll bridge will prolong recovery, but in the long run you keep more gains which is the whole idea. Dont knock it before you try it!!

Then you have to be a hardcore, 80mg ed dbol user to crash like that.....when I speak of dbol cycles and their users, I'm talking about SANE JUICERS who actually care about their liver. If you want to damage your health, plus pay more money for supplements, as well as delay your recovery big-time all over NOT BEING PYSCHOLOGICALLY ABLE to say "enough is enough, my health and cycle recovery is more important than completely stopping so my body can recovery", than go ahead Mr. Alzado.

 

[ready2explode]

Ulter is right on the money. Guys, crashing sucks BIG TIME!!!! If you dont get depressed and demotivated during a crash then you probobly are not taking your training as serious as the rest of us. Sure the dboll bridge will prolong recovery, but in the long run you keep more gains which is the whole idea. Dont knock it before you try it!!

First off, with what we know about post cycle therapy today, people should be able to recover very quickly post cycle. The ones that like this bridge are the ones that are so addicted to steroids that they cant come off.

If you slow recovery, you lengthen the time it takes to recover. It is absurd to think that a slower recovery would keep more gains overall than a quicker one bro. The faster you recover, the more gains will be kept. PERIOD.

 

[ready2explode]

Anyone who has crashed will tell you it is a miserable existance. You are depressed to the point you don't want to get out of bed. You can't train or have sex, you feel as though you have mono all day, and you cry uncontrollably every time you think about your situation.

LOL this is laughable, highly exaggerated AT BEST.

So would you rather use the dbol and feel great and have your natural test take 10-12 weeks to get to normal. Or not take it and wait it out for 6 weeks while crashing?
The brainiacs telling people that they will do better without it have no clue.

Hmmmm 10-12 weeks of feeling like shit or 6 weeks? I'll take six weeks any day.

 

[ulter]

First off, with what we know about post cycle therapy today, people should be able to recover very quickly post cycle.

Ah yes, the perfect world were all human bodies are the same. It's a nice dream and it sure would make medicine a lot easier to practice. But that's all it is... a dream.

 

[ready2explode]

I didnt read the entire thread, but all I have to say is everyone will react differently to this d-bol taper/bridge. One might recover differently every time.

I dont think we can generalize that everyone will react the same!

OH YES WE CAN! the numbers may not be exact, but one can certainly say FOR SURE that any additional androgens into the body will affect recovery. The slower the recovery the more gains that are lost.

 

[bigdelt69]

You guys are missing the whole point. Of course if you slow recovery then more gains CAN be lost. But doing it this way will allow you to keep a larger % of them. In most people, if they follow the bridge correctly they will ultimatly retain more gains than someone who used the traditional clomid theropy.

AS far as being additcted to steroids, we there is simply no such thing. There are on the other hand people who have problems with self esteme, self image, body dismorpha, ect.....these are more of the type of people who go insane with doses and dont know when to stop, or dont want to. There are also people who have made a life style out of this sport who are pretty much in the same boat. And ready2explode-not to flame ya brother, but like I said above....dont knock it till ya try it

Hulkster- I have no idea what messege you are trying to convey here, but its not as extreme as you might think. So guys lets not get into a flame fest over this, just remember that for most people, not all, but most, this works great!

 

[ready2explode]

You never know until you try it

I hate this line. I know too much heroin can kill me, and I've never even tried heroin. I know the dbol bridge will slow my recovery. Therefore, I will not even try it.

When Fonz posts some real evidence to back up his statement, I will think about it.

 

[ready2explode]

You guys are missing the whole point. Of course if you slow recovery then more gains CAN be lost. But doing it this way will allow you to keep a larger % of them. In most people, if they follow the bridge correctly they will ultimatly retain more gains than someone who used the traditional clomid theropy.

Do you re-read what you post before hitting that submit button? You say slowing recovery means more gains can be lost, but then you go on to say that the dbol bridge (which slows recovery) will retain more gains? Common bro, gotta pick...one or the other...

AS far as being additcted to steroids, we there is simply no such thing. There are on the other hand people who have problems with self esteme, self image, body dismorpha, ect.....these are more of the type of people who go insane with doses and dont know when to stop, or dont want to. There are also people who have made a life style out of this sport who are pretty much in the same boat. And ready2explode-not to flame ya brother, but like I said above....dont knock it till ya try it

Steroid addiction is very real, and quite possibly the biggest, most dangerous, side effect of steroids. Do you really want to debate this?

And, big delt, this thread has been flame free so far, and will continue to be so (at least on my part). I'm trying to help you out by telling you that it is not possible to retain more gains with the dbol bridge. By following my advice, you will keep more muscle, and your endocrine system will thank you. If you dont want to listen to it, then thats your fault.

Hulkster- I have no idea what messege you are trying to convey here, but its not as extreme as you might think. So guys lets not get into a flame fest over this, just remember that for most people, not all, but most, this works great!

How would you know? Do you have documented proof? No, because there is none. All you have heard is what ppl tell you. The problem with that is most ppl do not have the knowledge to make an educated conclusion about what they experience.

 

[ready2explode]

I believe the biggest problems post cycle are diet, training, and rest. These are all thing we empasize on a cycle, but hardly ever talk about after.

Most dont get enough rest on a cycle (at least 8 hours a nite) let alone off a cycle. Ppl have jobs, families, children, maybe school...there are a thousand reasons why we have to get up early and go to bed late.

Most ppl dont have a clue about how to train post cycle. Over AND under training happens quite often. Some keep their load the same as when on a cycle which is just plain crazy...your body doesnt recover as quickly. And some drop the volume AND the amount of weight which is not good. When training post cycle, you want to switch to a strength type routine. Keep weights either the same or raise them a little, and lower reps and volume. 5 reps and under is best.

Many ppl also dont take in enough calories to hold their newly aquired weight. If you're not giving your body the energy it needs to hold the muscle, it is not going to keep it.

These are the real and main reasons why ppl lose so much post cycle.

 

[ready2explode]

Ah yes, the perfect world were all human bodies are the same. It's a nice dream and it sure would make medicine a lot easier to practice. But that's all it is... a dream.

You know what the thing is ulter, ALL HUMAN BODIES WILL NOT PRODUCE TESTOSTERONE IF YOU'RE TAKING IN ADDITIONAL ANDROGENS. Yes, that can be stated for EVERY PERSON ON THE FACE OF THE PLANET.

One more time for the slow pokes, slower recovery means more gains will be lost.

 

[ulter]

That depends on how much testosterone you're adding bro.
You see those studies posted in the beginning of the thread. Those men were taking dbol. They were producing 40% of their natural test. So that silly line you have up there in caps is just that, silly.

Slower recovery has nothing to do with gains being lost.

You're pretty new to all this aren't you?

 

[bigdelt69]

Ok ready2explode here is what I meant when I was talking about slow recovery. Slower recovery CAN mean you loose more gains. BUT their are ways around this. The human body is easly fooled into doing different things. My whole point was that doing it the fonz way (wish i had a better name for it, lol) will result in slower recovery but in a way to preserve more gains. This takes some thought and reason to understand, and to completely understand you must try it and judge for yourself. We are all different and this may not work for everyone. For me, this is my life,and my passion. I was willing to put some risk into this theory of Fonz's and it worked for me, there was some other dude who posted above that it did not work for. So to each his own, but your way is not the only way, and please understand everyones body is different, what works for some may not work for all. And not all Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) will inhibit natural production of test. (var, primo, as well as several others)

What you stated above about the training, rest, and diet thing is the deffinetly the biggest factor when trying to hold gains. You are dead right there. But for us that have pushed our bodies to the max, and I do mean way beyond our genetic potential, there are other things that must be done.

To conclude: I have tried everything there is to try to aid in post cycle recovery. I know what works, and will continue to advocate this. I will also preach that just b/c it works for me does not mean it will work for you. And everyone please keep in mind.....for every study that says one thing, there is another study that will say the exact opposite.

 

[ready2explode]

That depends on how much testosterone you're adding bro.
You see those studies posted in the beginning of the thread. Those men were taking dbol. They were producing 40% of their natural test. So that silly line you have up there in caps is just that, silly.

Slower recovery has nothing to do with gains being lost.

You're pretty new to all this aren't you?

Bro, how about you go back to my first threads with the links to CEM and read those. They address this. Dont you think you should at least read the evidence I bring to the table before responding?

If your nat test is not up to par, then there is there is not going to be enough anabolism to hold the weight you have acquired. The longer the body is in this state, the more gains can/will be lost. How long it takes to recover has everything to do with keeping gains.

New to all this? CEM has some of the greatest minds that have ever hit the boards, and they all have come to one conclusion: FONZ BRIDGE THEORY IS BS.

 

[ready2explode]

And not all Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) will inhibit natural production of test. (var, primo, as well as several others)

Most of your post is incorrect. I'm too lazy to correct the whole thing except this:

http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/84/8/2705

 

[bigdelt69]

I just dont understand how you know this wont work when you have not tried it?

 

[!@#$%^&]

im gonna chime in here, and try to add a point (i know im gonna get killed for this lol)

The point of using the dbol at 10mg soon as you awake is to trick your body into thinking its the normal natural test spike, therefore it is not recognized as outside extra testosterone. Your body will then, along with the help of clomid/nolva, start to recover. Not as fast as it would if you were completly off the dbol, but better than nothing while still holding your gains. After around 4weeks on clomid/nolva/dbol your body will have recovered a bit. You can then drop the dbol and continue clomid/nolva therapy til you are recovered. I think proceeding with therapy from 40% recovered is better than starting baseline after coming right off a cycle.

 

[hhajdo]

"The point of using the dbol at 10mg soon as you awake is to trick your body into thinking its the normal natural test spike"

Slight increase of test which usually occurs in the morning in normal men is within normal range.
When you add Dbol, both your androgen & estrogen will increase, & LH pulses will be affected regardless of when you take it.. You can't avoid suppression.

Also..

...In hypogonadal men the mean testosterone concentrations were much lower than the healthy young or elderly men, and a straight-line model was the best descriptor (i.e., no circadian rhythm was detected)....

Modeling of circadian testosterone in healthy men and hypogonadal men.

Gupta SK, Lindemulder EA, Sathyan G.

 

[Hulkster]

People can throw around all the copied material being posted by the pseudo-junior chemists on this site, but the bottom line is:

1) Using the dbol bridge will DELAY YOUR RECOVERY, thus causing your liver to work harder and longer.

2)The longer you use toxic Anabolic Androgenic Steroids (AAS) (like dbol), the longer you delay post-cycle recovery. Thus, the greater chance that gains will be lost/reduced, as well as proper actions to be taken against increased estrogen levels (such as taking clomid/nolvadex/arimidex to avoid bitch-tits) will be delayed.

---NOTHING PERSONAL AGAINST ANYONE ON THIS SITE, but I hope some of you PRO-dbol bridge supporters have a bra handy---

I am someone who works in the medical profession WHO HAS REAL EXPERIENCE in hospitals, assisted-living facilities, etc. who has seen the affects of ALL SORTS OF DRUGS, WHETHER ILLEGAL OR LEGAL, ON THE HUMAN BODY. It's people like me who have to "clean up the messes" left by all of the wannabe medical professions who read a bogus 3rd rate medical article, and then post up that information as if it's coming from a real medical doctor. Does anyone who posts any of the medical studies on this website ACTUALLY HAVE ANY MEDICAL TRAINING OR EXPERIENCE, OR HAVE WORKED WITH REAL, LIVE HUMAN BEINGS (as well as dead cadavers) to see the TRUE EFFECTS AND CONSEQUENCES ON THE BODY FROM WRONG, IRRESPONSIBLE MEDICAL INFORMATION that is passed off as "science"? People need to start investigating what they are doing, before they turn out to be another Eric Perrin.

 

[ulter]

First let me say this for the last time, if there's a God it's the last time, THIS IS NOT FONZ'S THEORY. It's been used all over the world by body builders for over 20 years. Ok got that?
There is no evidence at CEM. There is no published evidence anywhere on the planet. This is another one of those situations where people are taking studies, that were not done under any of the conditions we need to have examined. Did any of the patients in these studies do a dbol bridge coming off a cycle where their natural test didn't kick in fast enough? Ah.... no.
Do I know 100+ people who HAVE used the dbol bridge to help a lagging HPTA? YES
I tire of these arm chair endocrinologists trying to find out whether or not a commonly used solution to a problem works by looking up studies. Why not ask a real live person who has done it? Or several people?
When you have solution that has been proven to work for so many people for so long who cares what the "greatest minds on the boards" find in some literature.
They are nice guys over there at CEM and some of them are pretty bright. But I can give you the names of lots people, if they'll let me, who used the dbol bridge successfully, some of them several times. I know Killer and Mr Nobody don't care, so there's two. Do you think the people who have used this bridge to save a crash care that the guys at CEM say it doesn't work?

 

[Hulkster]

Originally posted by ulter
First let me say this for the last time, if there's a God it's the last time, THIS IS NOT FONZ'S THEORY. It's been used all over the world by body builders for over 20 years. Ok got that?

HULKSTER: Well, ulter, Fonz has been shoving it done everyone's throat as if it was his theory.

Originally posted by ulter
Do I know 100+ people who HAVE used the dbol bridge to help a lagging HPTA? YES

I tire of these arm chair endocrinologists

HULKSTER: Arm chair? Excuse me, ulter, but I'm the ONLY DAMN PERSON ON THIS THREAD WHO HAS ESPOUSED TO HAVING ANY MEDICAL TRAINING AND EXPERIENCE WITH LIVE HUMAN BEINGS. Furthermore, I've worked with patients in hospitals (primarily emergency room settings), as well as assisted-living facilities. So I sure as hell am no "arm chair" anything when it comes to this subject. I've been down and dirty with patients, especially patients who abused their bodies and caused damage to those same bodies by following bogus medical advice and reports.

Originally posted by ulter

When you have solution that has been proven to work for so many people for so long who cares what the "greatest minds on the boards" find in some literature.

HULKSTER: Ulter, what you and others don't realize is that there IS NO NEED TO FIND ANOTHER SOLUTION!!! The problem is people who just can't pyschologically get their shit together and say, "ENOUGH IS ENOUGH, IT'S TIME FOR MY BODY'S RECEPTORS--AND LIVER--TO RECOVER". It's people who mentally can't stop using (or should I say abusing) dbol who need to create a "dbol bridge" as a foolish and unhealthy way to continue a dbol cycle, when they should GET OFF.