Waiting on corisol levels to start HRT, at the end of my rope.

[Alpin]

Your LH and FSH will shut down while on exogenous test. Period. No doubt about it.

The longer you are on exogenous test and shut down, the harder it is to get your HPTA restarted. That is why we say TRT "is for life". You don't go on it with plans of coming off later. Just not the way it works. If you want to avoid going on it, you try everything you possibly can to get your own T cranking out again first.

Yup. There's plenty of idiots in the medical community that use this tactic of going on TRT and coming off.
Ridiculous. Treat the thing properly from the get go and minimize the turbulence for the patient.

 

[WhatTRTmayCome]

Well im going to give the gels a shot anyway. My LH and FSH are in the crapper anyway so supression of that doesnt really matter now as it next to 0.


FSH 1.8 U/L ... 0.8-9.0

LH 1.6 U/L ... 0.8-7.6


Like I said he told me every second day at 25mg, I was onto the secretary and told her my situation and in the end he relayed back to her that I can take 50mg every second day now as opposed to 25mg.

My chemist told me its to be taken everyday, you guys say every day and even the label says everyday.

Besides all that I dont want to go against what the endo told me, solely on a morale scale. Im a honest person and I dont want to be in his office the next day and lie so im going to do what he said. Might not be the best thing to do but its the right thing and some test is better than no test.

On other news ive become very aware of my balls, I hear a lot of reports of aching balls, mine have a sensation in them day one after taking the gel, not a pain, just a sensation, almost like a very mild tingling. Is that normal?

 

[Megatron28]

Well im going to give the gels a shot anyway. My LH and FSH are in the crapper anyway so supression of that doesnt really matter now as it next to 0.


FSH 1.8 U/L ... 0.8-9.0

LH 1.6 U/L ... 0.8-7.6


Like I said he told me every second day at 25mg, I was onto the secretary and told her my situation and in the end he relayed back to her that I can take 50mg every second day now as opposed to 25mg.

My chemist told me its to be taken everyday, you guys say every day and even the label says everyday.

Besides all that I dont want to go against what the endo told me, solely on a morale scale. Im a honest person and I dont want to be in his office the next day and lie so im going to do what he said. Might not be the best thing to do but its the right thing and some test is better than no test.

On other news ive become very aware of my balls, I hear a lot of reports of aching balls, mine have a sensation in them day one after taking the gel, not a pain, just a sensation, almost like a very mild tingling. Is that normal?

I disagree. It is not the right thing to do. You know he is wrong so why would you follow his instructions? Instead of doing 50mg EOD you should take 25mg daily.

Let's pretend it is ibuprofen. He tells you to take 4 250mg pills every 8 hours. Everyone else and the instructions on the bottle tell you to take 2 250mg pills every 4 hours. Which do you do?

 

[WhatTRTmayCome]

Like I said man, probably not the best but the right thing to do as far as being honest with him.

I also have some faith in him seeing as he is a qualified endo and has dedicated his life and learning in this field. I would take his advice over the chemist, after all she is only reaidng whats on the packet and as far as whats written on the packet on dosage, not everyone requires the same dosage on any one medicatios, they are guidelines.

This is how he has chosen to treat me, I dont know if hes right or wrong but one thing I do know is that im not comfortable lieing to him and am not going to do it.

So im going to do what he says and see where it takes me, if it means 1.5 months wasted then so be it atleast my conscience will be clear and after the 1.5 months is up and if I have no improvement then hopefully I can suggest IM injections or upping the dose of the gel.

My next appointment with him is Nov 14, so I will be able to say all this to him and see if he will let me do it daily, I believe he would as he is a really nice and understanding guy, definitely the best doctor ive ever been to in that sense and you can tell he is genuinely interested in helping and treating me, hell he didnt even charge for my last follow up visit which should of been 70 bucks.

Anyway, ill hold tough until November, im not expecting any major changes to be honest but if I find any ill report them.

Also Tron I appreciate your advice, im not at all for one second saying your wrong and hes right, its a moral thing. Just how I operate as a person even do in this situation im my own worst enemy.

 

[Megatron28]

Like I said man, probably not the best but the right thing to do as far as being honest with him.

I also have some faith in him seeing as he is a qualified endo and has dedicated his life and learning in this field. I would take his advice over the chemist, after all she is only reaidng whats on the packet and as far as whats written on the packet on dosage, not everyone requires the same dosage on any one medicatios, they are guidelines.

This is how he has chosen to treat me, I dont know if hes right or wrong but one thing I do know is that im not comfortable lieing to him and am not going to do it.

So im going to do what he says and see where it takes me, if it means 3 months wasted then so be it atleast my conscience will be clear and after the 3 months is up and if I have no improvement then hopefully I can suggest IM injections or upping the dose of the gel.

Just so you know, endos are trained to treat diabetes. Do as you wish. You have been advised on what you should do. Good luck with the roller coaster ride you are about to embark on. I suggest you do some reading on half lives in the meantime.

Here is some reading on loading doses and maintenance doses.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loading_dose

 

[WhatTRTmayCome]

Thanks man, you replied before I could edit my post fully.

Ill read that now. I know im most likely in for a roller coaster, but ive been on it for a long time. Edit just read it and I take it even do its not directly mentioned, T is something you need to Load first then maintain right. So megatron, if it were you and you wanted to be able to say you take 50mg every other day, how would you load and for how long?

Basically I wouldnt be opposed to loading with the gels for a week then do every other day like he did prescribe, that way I wouldnt be lieing to him. As it stands because of a mix up of my prescription I now have 14 extra 50mg sachets that im not supposed to have. I was given 30 by the chemist and im only supposed to have goten 14 but that has been corrected so from now on ill only be getting 14 50mg sachets a month.

So I have 14 exta Tron, im willing to load on them and then continue on 50mg every 2 days. How should I do it? See im willing to meet halfway and this way I technically wont be lieing

 

[Chiefy]

Thanks man, you replied before I could edit my post fully.

Ill read that now. I know im most likely in for a roller coaster, but ive been on it for a long time. Edit just read it and I take it even do its not directly mentioned, T is something you need to Load first then maintain right. So megatron, if it were you and you wanted to be able to say you take 50mg every other day, how would you load and for how long?

Basically I wouldnt be opposed to loading with the gels for a week then do every other day like he did prescribe, that way I wouldnt be lieing to him. As it stands because of a mix up of my prescription I now have 14 extra 50mg sachets that im not supposed to have. I was given 30 by the chemist and im only supposed to have goten 14 but that has been corrected so from now on ill only be getting 14 50mg sachets a month.

So I have 14 exta Tron, im willing to load on them and then continue on 50mg every 2 days. How should I do it? See im willing to meet halfway and this way I technically wont be lieing

Definitely do not "load" with more gel. That will increase your E2 and cause unwanted side effects. Doesn't sound like your doctor is the type who would prescribe something to manage E2 if it became an issue either.

Topical testosterone is all about giving yourself an even dose on a regular basis. Using it every other day is not going to achieve this, and will cause your hormone levels to fluctuate unnecessarily.

It's also a low dose to begin with, and you will not be absorbing the majority of the testosterone that you're applying. Many guys who use low dose topicals end up with T levels that are lower than before they started. It's enough T to tell your body to stop producing its own, but not enough to replace it with normal levels.

 

[Alpin]

Just so you know, endos are trained to treat diabetes. Do as you wish. You have been advised on what you should do. Good luck with the roller coaster ride you are about to embark on.

Now you're talking!!!!!

 

[WhatTRTmayCome]

Definitely do not "load" with more gel. That will increase your E2 and cause unwanted side effects. Doesn't sound like your doctor is the type who would prescribe something to manage E2 if it became an issue either.

Topical testosterone is all about giving yourself an even dose on a regular basis. Using it every other day is not going to achieve this, and will cause your hormone levels to fluctuate unnecessarily.

It's also a low dose to begin with, and you will not be absorbing the majority of the testosterone that you're applying. Many guys who use low dose topicals end up with T levels that are lower than before they started. It's enough T to tell your body to stop producing its own, but not enough to replace it with normal levels.

Ok well despite me being difficult Tron (which isnt my intention just all new to this) I think were on the same page now. I wont load it, ill use 25mg a day for a even dose. Im of the mindset now that endos can prescribe me the meds, but I have to be well informed (thanks to you guys) on how to take it and guide the endos hand in giving me what I really need in terms of upping the dose, pushing for higher doses etc.

As far as it being a low dose I do agree with that, hes probably of the mindset that he wants to approach it with a low dose to see how I respond (which I probably wont at that dose) as ive read that people can absorb it differently, some respond well some dont as with any medication.

If I end up with lower levels, yeah ill feel worse but on the other hand if my T comes back worse it might be a good thing as it would then be a option to highten the dose and or introduce IM injections.

So all that said thanks for steering me in the right direction. Ill take the 25mg everyday now up until Nov 14, see how I feel then and the week before ill meet with him ill report in here and tell you guys how I am feeling and based off that, devise a plan on what to say to him in the checkup and pose to him possible altercations to my treatment.

Sound good?

 

[WhatTRTmayCome]

Guys quick question, how much of an effcet can dieting/calorie restriction have on your T.

Say you T was at 500 pre diet and you dieted for 6 months, any idea of how much of a drop you could expect?

Is it drastic or minimal?

 

[Chiefy]

Guys quick question, how much of an effcet can dieting/calorie restriction have on your T.

Say you T was at 500 pre diet and you dieted for 6 months, any idea of how much of a drop you could expect?

Is it drastic or minimal?

It depends on the diet but, yes, diet has a powerful effect on T levels. If you're not giving your body what it needs to function, hormone levels will suffer.

There really isn't a way to estimate how much a certain diet will affect T levels in terms of ng/dl. There are just too many variables.

 

[Megatron28]

There is a recent thread on a guy who probably shut down his naty T with calorie restriction and over training. Look for it.

 

[WhatTRTmayCome]

The reason im asking is because ive really been struggling with the idea of trt.

I had been dieting for 6 months prior to getting my fasted T. Lost 25lbs. Its now in range 9-30, mine was 13.6 but I still have all the symptoms of low T but I now think it was lowish because of dieting.

Im now currently trying to find my maintenance calories and staying around that for a while.

But ive started trt with the gels and feel I have shot myself in the foot. If diet can bring my T up great but ive started trt so thats going to shut me down. Also last night I got a strange pulsing in my right testicle which ive never had in my life so I think hormonal changes are starting.

What I actually want to do right now, if I had the chance would be to stop TRT, go on clomid for 3 months combined with the new diet and see if that helps. I tried contacting my endo last week about this, left numerous messages with his secretary but he never contacted me back, guess its a case of you have to pay to speak to him which is crappy given I am a patient of his.

But my appointment isnt until next month with the endo and im afraid just to stop TRT on my own without his advise and coupled with the fact that ive just started. Im 11 days on T, should I just stop, wait until I go to the endo and explain this to him, or should I continue with it until I see him.

What I want to do right now is stop, take a step back and be realistic with myself. I think the diet and my training had a lot to do with my low T. I want to stop guys, right now, is it ok to do so 11 days in?

Would really appreciate advice on this guys.

 

[methos0123]

Yes. If you want to stop, stop. You should not have a hard time recouping after 11 days.

 

[WhatTRTmayCome]

Yes. If you want to stop, stop. You should not have a hard time recouping after 11 days.

Yeah I think the same especially since it was only gel that I was using at 25mg a day.

Any other thoughts, on using clomid with the new diet. Would that even be necessary to do?

Would it do any harm to use clomid anyway for 3 months. I dont think there would since all it does is get your own body producing its own T at its best ability or is there harm in using it?

 

[Megatron28]

Yeah I think the same especially since it was only gel that I was using at 25mg a day.

Any other thoughts, on using clomid with the new diet. Would that even be necessary to do?

Would it do any harm to use clomid anyway for 3 months. I dont think there would since all it does is get your own body producing its own T at its best ability or is there harm in using it?

There are risk factors with using Clomid. It is a drug after all.

 

[WhatTRTmayCome]

There are risk factors with using Clomid. It is a drug after all.

So should I not take clomid and just see where improved diet takes me?

Also is stopping now ok to do. I didnt apply any this morning.

 

[Megatron28]

I am not saying don't run Clomid, but do your homework and understand what risks you are taking by choosing to use it.

Stopping now and fixing your diet sounds like a great idea.